WILOO is using Luchtzak.be ...

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 15:28

WILOO (Werkgroep Impact Luchthaven Oostende op Omgeving) has used my topic as their source of the incident of Air Memphis.

http://users.skynet.be/wiloo/su-avz_crasht.htm

WILOO is just a group of small children that make an elephant out of ants ... They manipulate the public opinion with lies and half-trueths. I am truelly sick of this organisation ...

:shoot: :shoot: :shoot: WILOO ...

You should see the rubbish they publish ...
It's really unbelievable what they wouldn't do to change the public opinion !

As much as I like Luchtzak, I do not want them to use the info I supply about EBOS ... Sorry guys, this was my last post with negative news on EBOS ... From now on no more ...

Greetz,

Andries

Post by **sn26567** » 06 Apr 2004, 16:21

Andries,

You have not done anything wrong. Keep posting news.

They also link to a Luchtzak news article about a ban of Air Memphis in France. This article has been withdrawn, because the source was not reliable.

Post by **Bottie** » 06 Apr 2004, 16:29

Can't you, or one of the luchtzak-admins, send them a mail to tell them to remove the link from "wiloo" to the topic on luchtzak due to copyrights?

Post by **sn26567** » 06 Apr 2004, 16:47

Bottie wrote:Can't you, or one of the luchtzak-admins, send them a mail to tell them to remove the link from "wiloo" to the topic on luchtzak due to copyrights?

That would be too simple: a link to a public website is not a copyright infringement.

A solution would be to reserve the forums to members only. We did it in the past, but abandoned the idea beause we wanted to be as open to the world as possible.

Give us some time to discuss it again between admins.

Post by **sn26567** » 06 Apr 2004, 16:55

It seems that WILOO made succesful lobbying:

AIR MEMPHIS MAG NIET MEER VLIEGEN OP BELGIE

De Egyptische luchtvaartmaatschappij Air Memphis mag niet meer vliegen in ons land. Dat heeft het Bestuur der Luchtvaart beslist.

Vorige vrijdag stortte een Boeing 707 van de luchtvaartmaatschappij neer,
kort nadat hij was opgestegen in Caïro. Het toestel had als bestemming
Oostende.

Een actiegroep in Oostende zei daarna dat de ramp evengoed bij hen had kunnen gebeuren en eiste een verbod op onveilige toestellen.

Het is al het derde toestel van Air Memphis dat neerstort.

Teletekst TV1 6 April

Translation: Air Memphis is banned in Belgium by the Aviation Administration. Last Friday an Air Memphis 707 with destination Ostend crashed near Cairo shortly after take-off. A lobbying group of Ostend said the crash could have occurred here and wanted a ban on dangerous aircraft. It is already the 3rd crash of an Air Memphis plane.

SAH9101 · Post by **SAH9101** » 06 Apr 2004, 16:59

I suggest deletion of the post. The info is unconfirmed but the post on the luchtzak.be forum was used as a link in a press release of wiloo. Deleting the post would make the link (sole source for wiloo) useless.

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 17:13

I agree 100% !!! Delete my post !!!

Greetz,

Andries

OO-VEX · Post by **OO-VEX** » 06 Apr 2004, 17:17

sn26567 wrote: A solution would be to reserve the forums to members only. We did it in the past, but abandoned the idea beause we wanted to be as open to the world as possible.

I do not think that would be a good decision, because you still don't know who are the members. Everyone would still be able to ask membership, so reserving the forums for members only is not at all a solution.

OO-VEX

Airborne · Post by **Airborne** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:09

What about this?
It's forbidden to use/to link to this content for political purposes!

Greetzzz,
Kristof

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:09

OO-VEX wrote:
sn26567 wrote: A solution would be to reserve the forums to members only. We did it in the past, but abandoned the idea beause we wanted to be as open to the world as possible.
I do not think that would be a good decision, because you still don't know who are the members. Everyone would still be able to ask membership, so reserving the forums for members only is not at all a solution.

OO-VEX

Exactly ! There even is a realic chance that they allready are a member in case it would become a members-only forum ... It would not be the first time the pretend to be spotters ...

I remember about 3 years ago a person came to me and we started talking. He said he was a spotter and then asked me for the registrations of that day. What a fool I was ! It appeared to be one of the WILOO-members. They do this allot, especcially with young spotters (because they usually are new to the spotters-world ...)

So don't be fooled, they could even be an active member ...

Greetz,

Andries

Robin_Bamps · Post by **Robin_Bamps** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:12

The news about Wiloo and SU-AVZ was also featured in the television news at 13:00 on TV1.

But just like André already said, Andries has done nothing wrong.

Wiloo, the organisation as well as their website is only B*LLSH*T (sorry for my expression). Look at the expressions they use in their press releases.

I quote from the press release on their website :

"Het gammel ding" "Europa's vuilste luchthaven EBOS-Oostende" "dit vliegend wrak" "een verbod op vluchten van zowel Air Memphis als van deze van de andere brol dat onze onwelriekende luchthaven nog dagelijks aandoet !"

Wiloo ... :pang:

Regards, Robin Bamps.

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:13

Airborne wrote:What about this?
It's forbidden to use/to link to this content for political purposes!

Greetzzz,
Kristof

Would be a great idea if you have a normal organisation ...
:shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead: :shakehead:
WILOO is different ! It' wouldn't be the first time they violatedcopyright laws or things like that ... I lost track of the amount of times they used pictures of ostend spotters on their site without the spotters even knowing it ...
That why I started to check their website allmost daily

Greetz,

Andries

Post by **luchtzak** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:16

Andries,

I assure you that you didn't do anything wrong. In press-releases you are supposed to give correct information and not information that is coming from an aviation forum. It's their choice to use that kind of information without checking other sources.

greetings,

Bart
:rock:

Post by **luchtzak** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:18

And I am 100% sure 'het bestuur der luchtvaart' used other sources to stop Air Memphis flying to Belgium.

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:25

I hope so ... otherwise ...

The problem also is that the press really like their stories because they think that's what people like to read ...

Luckelly we have REPLO since 2 years. It's a group that wants to give the public the correct view on Ostend Airport. When WILOO publishes an article in some newspaper, REPLO allmost immediatly reacts with an article of their own correcting the first article and giving the people the correct info ...
If you want, you can visit them on http://www.replo.be

Greetz,

Andries

dna · Post by **dna** » 06 Apr 2004, 18:47

I didn't know about REPLO, that's really good to know.

I am fed up with WILOO's attitude (and that of many others), complaining about airports in built-up areas (we're heading the same way with Zaventem I'm sure). No one ever seems to point out that in the case of Ostend, the shopping centre that is always mentioned in WILOO's doom and gloom press releases, was built long after the airport was established. And the same goes for many of the houses/buildings in the area.

It is a pity that REPLO's concerns never seem to be mentioned in the press or am I wrong? Make sure you pass them on to redactie@belga.be

Dave

744rules · Post by **744rules** » 06 Apr 2004, 19:10

If memory serves right, this shopping center annex houses were built with negative advice, which means they should have known the positive/negative items. But as so often, money dictates

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 19:14

744rules wrote:If memory serves right, this shopping center annex houses were built with negative advice, which means they should have known the positive/negative items. But as so often, money dictates

Your memory serves you well !
All parcels got a negative building-advice because of the approach line of EBOS ...
One of WILOO's ex-presidents even sold lots of those parcels ... He'd check when aircraft would be arriving and when he was shure no aircaft had to land at a certain time, he'd take the potential buyers to the parcel and show them that you have absolutely no trouble with overflying aircraft ... :shakehead:

What people wouldn't do for money ...

Greetz,

Andries

SAH9101 · Post by **SAH9101** » 06 Apr 2004, 19:23

None of the people at Ostend who received info about the Memphis incident posted UNCONFIRMED info on the internet except ONE!
The result: Memphis banned and a negative image about Ostend again. Very well done! Thanks.
Hope it's a lesson for the future.

Andries · Post by **Andries** » 06 Apr 2004, 19:31

I just picked this up from their website :

WILOO wrote:OO-VLO een Fokker F-27 van de VLM (Vlaamse Luchtvaart Maatschappij) oefent uren boven woonwijken, scholen enz... Als of er nergens luchthavens zonder omwonenden bestaan.

Foei VLM! bekijk onze geluidsmeting

It says :
OO-VLO, a Fokker F-27 of VLM (Vlaamse Luchtvaart Maatschappij) practices for hours over neighbourhoods, schools, etc.
Like airports without people living around it don't exist

Not good VLM See our soundmeterings ...

Since when is OO-VLO a Fokker 27 ???

Since when is there moren then 1 school in the approach line ???

Where do you find an airport without people living next to it within a small ratio of VLM's homebase Antwerp ???

F-27 :

Or they just don't know the difference between a F-50 and an F-27

Or they want people to believe that's it's a very old airplane

Schools :

There is only one school in the approach line and that school was built in the last 10 years ...

Airport without people living next to it :
Where should VLM go ?

Brussels is to busy

In antwerp you have more people than in Ostend ...

Maybe they could go to Siberia for touch and goes ...

This clearly shows that these people don't know sh*t about aviation and are just thinking about themselfs ...

Greetz,

Andries