Knight255 wrote:Why the anti-American sentiment may I ask?? If the product best fits your needs, use it!!!! Hell German and Japanese cars are better than American, but I don't blindly stand by GM and Ford!!! Take the best product in the market, and the airlines that need to expand their fleet have spoken through their orders.
I don't really think the Boeing products are that superior to Airbus' to such an extent. Yes, currently the market sentiment seems to be in Boeing's favour but that doesn't necessarily mean they haved exceeded Airbus in terms of the quality.
Why the anti-American sentiment? Well, its the way they have been exploiting their economic affluence to supress all other countries. and quite frankly, Boeing has been one of the largest beneficieries of their government's policies of that nature. But for most, I really think its the fact that Airbus had been an underdog for so long trying to chase the leader Boeing and in the process making significant contributions to the industry that Airbus comes across with better impression.
Pardon my very biased opinions but I think they have solid reasons
Knight255 wrote:.......
Why the anti-American sentiment? Well, its the way they have been exploiting their economic affluence to supress all other countries. .....
Haven't ,for example the French,the Chinese or Russians, done the same thing
ryanCX wrote: But for most, I really think its the fact that Airbus had been an underdog for so long trying to chase the leader Boeing and in the process making significant contributions to the industry that Airbus comes across with better impression.
Pardon my very biased opinions but I think they have solid reasons
Well, of course you do, but for the most part, BULLFEATHERS. The U.S. has, since WWII gone WAY OUT OF ITS WAY to help other countries re-build their economies often at a "price" to their own. As to the government owned and subsidized consortium know as Airbus, Boeing should be flattered that Airbus thinks so much of Boeing designs they copied the B707, but larger of course, when they built the A340.
I don't really think the Boeing products are that superior to Airbus' to such an extent.
I never said that Boeing products were superior, I said that the customers like their benefits over Airbus's products. Both Airbus and Boeing make superb products. Why because Airbus WAS an underdog do they make a better impression???? Boeing hasn't always been the corporate giant that it is today. It got where it is by making good airplanes (and today, space + military products). Lets not let this turn into a A vs. B war and lets acknowledge that both companies make fine airplanes.
"What's this button do?? I don't know, push it and find out................."
Look this is not like road cars where you can say 'oh i think BMW makes better cars than Mercedes', these are revenue generating planes!! It's not for fun, if both are not equally excellent, then one will fall... And you have to admit that Boeing didn't do a good job a few years back, it was even said that if the 787 project was grounded, Boeing would close down..
ryanCX wrote: But for most, I really think its the fact that Airbus had been an underdog for so long trying to chase the leader Boeing and in the process making significant contributions to the industry that Airbus comes across with better impression.
Pardon my very biased opinions but I think they have solid reasons
Well, of course you do, but for the most part, BULLFEATHERS. The U.S. has, since WWII gone WAY OUT OF ITS WAY to help other countries re-build their economies often at a "price" to their own. As to the government owned and subsidized consortium know as Airbus, Boeing should be flattered that Airbus thinks so much of Boeing designs they copied the B707, but larger of course, when they built the A340.
I'm sure it took a lot more than just the design to put the A340 in the sky! and Airbus also haven't been just there copying designs.. they were the one to come up with the fly-by-wire system, which by the way even Boeing thought was impressive enough to use for the 777s Plus their innovation entrepreneurial spirit is very well reflected in the A380 as well as their other products.
However even Boeing have come up with products like the 747, 777 and recently the 787 which, I think is fair enough to say have revolutionised the industry.
In the end yes! Opinions like mine aren't the ones making decisions for the airlines. All I'm saying is that I favour Airbus the current developments in the press.
and finally yes, all countries have exploited their economic affluence, but i think its safe to say the America has taken it to a new height.
It was quite fact that Boeing will be grounded if the 787 programme fails... anyway, this is obviously not the case now...
btw, i think Airbus has the better pilot control sidestick that all pilots prefer over the conventional Boeing control thing??? I mean aircraft is not like cars where designs can be 'copied', even if the exterior looks similar, this is a huge piece of engineering that unless you steal designs paper works, technologies or 'designs' can't be just used...
CX wrote:....i think Airbus has the better pilot control sidestick that all pilots prefer over the conventional Boeing control thing???
Perfect example of what I was talking about.
"all pilots prefer"???????? Do you have an independent survey in black and white that shows this to actually be the case?
CX wrote:It was quite fact that Boeing will be grounded if the 787 programme fails... anyway, this is obviously not the case now...
Another example, "quite fact." And this was said by whom? You are entitled to your opinion, of course, BUT do you have a statement by a believable source that would indicate this to be true?
ryanCX wrote: fly-by-wire system, which by the way even Boeing thought was impressive enough to use for the 777s
Boeing has fly-by-wire in the 747-400. Also, with Boeing's FBW system the pilot has the last say. It think it was Airbus' FBW system that put a plane into a forest killing 3 people when it would not give control back to the pilot. Fact, not personal opinion or prejudice. Look it up.
Last edited by PYX on 27 Nov 2005, 10:39, edited 1 time in total.
and finally yes, all countries have exploited their economic affluence, but i think its safe to say the America has taken it to a new height.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I doubt very much this is the case, other than by sheer force, i.e., the size of the U.S. economy. Due to my own personal prejudices and biases I would have to see it in print from a reputable source before I would believe it.
they were the one to come up with the fly-by-wire system
Actually military airplanes have been using fly-by-wire systems for decades before Airbus implemented it into their airplanes.
Airbus has the better pilot control sidestick that all pilots prefer over the conventional Boeing control thing???
I am a pilot, and I disagree. Pilots like controls that they were trained on. A lot of military pilots prefer the side-stick because that's what they were initially trained on. I also disagree about the FBW systems. Boeing and Airbus have two different viewpoints concerning pilot control, and both companies have good points. I personally do not care for "hard-limit" FBW systems. I will refuse to fly an airplane for a living that has that type of FBW system. And believe me, I am NOT the only pilot who thinks this. Talk to any Southwest, AA, Continental pilot and I am sure you will hear similar preferences.
"What's this button do?? I don't know, push it and find out................."
C_J wrote:This topic is supposed to say something about the Dubai Airshow...
Quite right you are C_J !
May I invite everyone to end the off-topic discussion (or start a new topic about the other matter) and contine with the Dubai Air Show, otherwise we will have to close this topic.
PYX it was on TV reports as well as some online articles which suggested Boeing will be grounded if the 787 project fails, and if you think a few year's back, it was really looking THAT bad for Boeing, and it's not my opinion, it was reported! Who said it? Well those TV programmes were on DW TV in my memory.. It's nothing against Boeing, i think you are too sensitive. The control thing, it's not MY opinion for god's sake, i am not even a pilot, how can I make an opinion on the control of the aircraft? It was also somewhere I read that pilots prefer the sidestick thing while Boeing insisted to keep their own thing... None of it is my opinion, it's just from stuff I've read...
What Knight255 said is his opinion, what I have said is from stuff I've read which maybe someone else's opinion, but not mine!
I think Boeing would not have "grounded" even without the B787 program, but it would certainly make Boeing in a bad position. Boeing is big enough to sustain itself for a while; after all, they don't only sell comercial jetliners.
I don't know which is make better jetliners. Based on some MRO people that I've heard from, the best "quality-wise" plane maker is MD, which is now part of Boeing. The only problem with any plane that I've flown is the A340. I flew it once on a long-haul flight, and to me, it vibrates in a way that I felt like the plane is coming apart, especially in turbulent. B747 doesn't vibrate like that, but of course, B747 is much bigger and may not be a fair comparison. The MRO people said that Airbus constructs plane differently from Boeing, but quality-wise, they're the same; thus, the vibration problem that I mentioned is nothing wrong with it, they say.
Sorry guys but C-J and Luchtzak had asked to stay on topic. We are now on page 4 and it's still a discussion between Airbus and Boeing and not about the Dubai airshow.
If we make a resume of this topic, I came to 1 page. So I want to ask to the moderators to take some action because other members don't put their comments anymore on this topic due to this off topics.
Boeing hasn't always been the corporate giant that it is today. It got where it is by making good airplanes (and today, space + military products). Lets not let this turn into a A vs. B war and lets acknowledge that both companies make fine airplanes. 
