Here we go again: new aviation tax ?

[Acid-drop]

Of course it will hurt everybody, but not because travel is more expensive, but more because concurence between countries will increase.
We were all laughing when the dutch came with some tax, but now it's our turn.
The problem is all different if it's a european tax.

I don't think the 10 euro tax will influence too much the volume of pax ... the increased of fuel price didn't hurt that much our airports ...

Anyway, this tax is not yet in place. The walloon minister already said he will fight against it, easy to understand why.

[Atlantis]

Not only LCC or regular airlines are involved also the charter companies. Some of them are selling "seats only" and some of them are cheap. All what we build up in a very short time (3 to 4 years) can be disappear in one second. And what about the jobs???

[Atlantis]

And the first reaction of CRL-airport is in: a spokemen says that this is the end of the airport.

[regi]

Hold on a second:
some years ago , the french economy was doing pretty bad. So the government made a new law forbidding French citizens to bring more than +- 1.000 euros accross the border - for holiday or business. ( I forgot the right amount, it was still in french francs . Please fill in the right amount if somebody remembers )
The explanation was that the government wanted the French people to spend their money on holidays in France and not abroad.
But the wide use of credit cards quickly overtook this rule. I don't know if this law still exists.

If we translate this to the new departure taxes, it is a kind of mesage to the travellers to spend their holidays in Belgium, drive in traffic jams to the coast, pay high parking fees and pay for lodging and meals on private accounts.

So back to the eighties, the 15 years of Belgian crisis.

[jan_olieslagers]

Ryanair will stop flying out of Charleroi on the the day that the tax comes into effect.

Isn't that a bit overrated? They are still flying to/from Eindhoven, aren't they?

[sn26567]

Flight tax

Brussels Airport may become the third most expensive airport in Europe

"Enormous efforts have been made in the past few years to give Brussels Airport - the second largest growth centre in Belgium and accounting for 1.5% of GDP - new impetus after the insolvency of Sabena and the withdrawal of many international players from Brussels", says Wilfried Van Assche, CEO of Brussels Airport.

A good example of this is the arrival of India's Jet Airways, which decided to make Brussels its international hub. In the past year, 700,000 passengers have already been able to use this hub at Brussels Airport. Other international players have also come (back) to Brussels, such as Etihad, Ethiopian, Hainan and US Airways.

This has resulted in many new direct connections between Brussels, the capital of Europe, and key international destinations within and outside Europe.

It has also ensured the creation of a large number of jobs at the airport. At the end of 2007, 21,000 people worked at the airport, about 1,100 more compared with two years before. This does not include the jobs created indirectly, estimated at a further 2,150.

The new flight tax could put these extra jobs at risk, according to Mr Van Assche.

In this regard, he points to what was said by Dutch Secretary of State for Finance, Mr de Jager, in a Parliamentary debate a couple of months ago, that is to say that the introduction of flight taxes by our northern neighbours could, over time, result in the loss of 5,000 to 10,000 jobs in and around Schiphol airport.

A key criterion for airlines in deciding whether to fly to a given destination is the "airport visiting cost" of that destination. As a medium-sized airport, Brussels Airport has always ensured that the visiting cost is competitive compared to other European airports.

With the introduction of an airport tax, this will no longer be the case. Brussels will suddenly become much more expensive than comparable airports in Europe and the third most expensive airport in Europe after London Heathrow and Amsterdam, two mega hubs.

Mr Van Assche concludes by saying: "Airport activity will undoubtedly shrink as a result, leading to job losses. This is clearly not something that is desirable in the current difficult economic and social environment".

Brussels Airport is therefore calling for urgent talks with the government.


Brussels Airport Company news release 16/10/2008

[airazurxtror]

The tour operators and travel agents have been stupid enough to boast until quite recently that, notwithstandig the crisis, the summer season had been excellent and the bookings for the winter were better than ever.
That was asking for trouble, or at least for more taxes.

[regi]

and Arcelor Mittal anounced a 15% production drop which will have immediate effect on the Liège and Zelzate plants. Not yet in Charleroi.

[LX-LGX]

The tour operators and travel agents have been stupid enough to boast until quite recently that, notwithstandig the crisis, the summer season had been excellent and the bookings for the winter were better than ever. That was asking for trouble, or at least for more taxes.

Seems you are not that familiar with the travel trade.

The travel trade has never said that 2008 was excellent. Summer 2008 showed indeed more bookings. ABTO, Association of Belgian Touroperators, says number of clients +5% but with a drop in average per client. Long haul has declined, probably because of the high fuel surcharges.

Bookings for the winter 2008-2009 (= as from mid December) are terrible. Repeat: terrible.

Bookings for the autumn school holiday (25/10/2008-02/11/2008) are indeed excellent, mainly because a rush to travel agencies in Aug/Sept, after a period of terrible summer weather in Belgium.

[airazurxtror]

Seems you are not that familiar with the travel trade.

Indeed - I know just what their representatives tell on the RTBF and RTL-TVI; the last time was two or three days ago, and they have surely not uttered the word "terrible" or even "bad" about the winter reservations.
What one often hear from them is : "the Belgian will save on a lot of things, but won't ever do without his holiday abroad".

[Acid-drop]

Regi, I dont know what you try to show us here ... I don't see how arcelor mital is linked to aviation or the new tax ...
Dont forget also that this production cut is the result of less production in the car industry and other manufacturing business in Belgium. The whole country is suffering those days.
I also hope that you don't link the whole economic situation of Charleroi to Arcelor, this would be totally ridiculous

[teach]

Indeed - I know just what their representatives tell on the RTBF and RTL-TVI; the last time was two or three days ago, and they have surely not uttered the word "terrible" or even "bad" about the winter reservations.

On Flemish tv it was said a few days ago that bookings for the winter season are down about 10% compared to last year.

[regi]

To Acid-Drop:
the remark about the 15% production drop of Arcelor Mittal was mentioned because I placed already before a message about employment in the Charleroi area.
You are right that AM has nothing to do with aviation, but it was about the negative impact of the new aviation tax on employment in a region where there is still a lot of unemployment, combined with some very large employers such as Caterpillar, AM and the airport.
Around Brussels there are more alternatives to find a decent job than around Charleroi.

Are there already some estimations what the job loss would be if that tax is applied?

[Acid-drop]

As Charleroi is booming, I expect more a slowdown than a recession ...
But Ryanair is the boss, so anything can happen ...

[LX-LGX]

Are there already some estimations what the job loss would be if that tax is applied?

A study from SEO Economic Research showed that the Dutch tax will make all Dutch airports loose some 4,5% pax:
2% will depart from Belgium, Germany or France
1% will travel by car or train
1,5% will simply cancel (mainly the LCC-travellers)

Job losses hasn't been estimated yet, but the ANVR (the Dutch travel trade organization) and the NBTC (Dutch board for tourism and congresses) have ordered an independent report on the total income loss by this Dutch tax. ANVR and NBTC hope the report will be ready early 2009.

Source (ANVR = sorry, Dutch only):
http://www.anvr.travel/persbericht.php? ... cht_id=631

Info on the research team that will do the study:
http://www.seo.nl/en/aviation/introduction.html

[NCB]

It is shameful that the government must add this tax but it is for the best.

Belgium is a small country relying solely on about 6 million taxpayers and highly relying on importing-manufacturing-exporting of goods, the harbor of Antwerp for transit of merchandise and major financial institutions.

Every single of these sectors are doing bad and the government is spending alot of money for that purpose.
It's either you pay 10 euro more for your airline tickets now, or leave a mountain of debts for your children and grand children to deal with.

That is exactly what is happening in the United States.

Let's not forget that we're aviation enthusiasts and that we're citizens too.

[regi]

It is never funny when we have to pay taxes and certainly not if it are new taxes.
On the other hand, we should be happy that we are so rich that we can pay aviation taxes. It means we are wealthy enough to fly. It is not so long ago that we travelled by road or by train on medium -long distances.
But the Low cost carriers have changed the aviation industry in such a way that people who would never have the financial possebilities, started to use flying to save money ! It is cheaper sometimes to take a 1 hour airplane than a 10 hour bus from Poland.
And it is this group that is in danger to disappear. If they make up their bill, and find out that it is cheaper to travel again by bus or train, we loose aviation jobs.
Those jobs will not come back through railway transport because the trains always drive, full or empty. In contrast to O'Learry his planes.
I am 100% sure that the aviation tax will destroy jobs. But I don't know if the money generated by those jobs will equal the taxes. I do also have my strongest doubts about the Belgian government that they would have those data. The decision was made so quickly, they had no reports ready.

[LX-LGX]

BRU, CRL and the Belgian travel trade have opened an internet petition against the new tax:

More info in Dutch about this joined action:
http://www.stopdevliegtickettaks.be

More info in French about this joined action:
http://www.stoplataxesurlesbilletsdavion.be

If you don’t have much time now, please do sign! You don't have to register, so it will just take you 10 seconds to do so:
http://www.stoplataxesurlesbilletsdavio ... fault.aspx
http://www.stopdevliegtickettaks.be/Sig ... fault.aspx

(only your name and location will be shown on the net. Your e-mail-adress will not be shown).
- - -

For those having a website: the HTML codes for a banner on your site can be found here:
http://www.stopdevliegtickettaks.be/Ref ... fault.aspx
http://www.stoplataxesurlesbilletsdavio ... fault.aspx

[Atlantis]

The federal government will just their money back when they have to pay the penalty's (noise restrictions) to all those actiongroups. Those groups are very happy with this new tax.

I'm very curious what the new aviation plan of mr. Schouppe will bring. Normally we will get those new plans in a week or two.

[Acid-drop]

Did they ever pay any cents for those noice restrictions ?
The gov is outlaw is this wonderful country

but on the other side, a new plan can only bring bad news for BRU, so i'm not sure it's so good to hope for news