Possible scam with take-off weight at Ryanair

[teddybAIR]

I thought the whole discussion was about how they administratively handled the TOW for optimalisation of flight service fees, not actually flying over the MTOW.

[tolipanebas]

According to this article, Ryanair has been advised of their violation of German rules and is paying according to the rules now, so I guess a rectifying bill will soon follow:
http://www.handelsblatt.com/unternehmen ... 43232.html

In case you are interested in the original article most other news sources are quoting, here's the link:
http://www.welt.de/print/welt_kompakt/p ... enzen.html
Fairly detailed and to the point, IMHO.
Sounds like Eurocontrol will send FR the highest bill of all: €50m for just one year, and that is without fine.

[tolipanebas]

Now also in Dutch:
http://www.standaard.be/Artikel/Detail. ... 9_00407350

No journo's nonsense after all it seems, fcw.

FWIW - Ryanair are flying 300 planes and yet they fail to apply basic rules on ATC fees? Is it really just total incompetence, or was it done on purpose in order to save money? Guess this will end up in court, as that money will have to be returned not just for this year, but for several years, possibly with a fine added to it.

[sean1982]

Is that condscending tone in the style of "mine is bigger then yours" seriously necessary in every single post you write??

[tolipanebas]

Don't like it being caught red handed, again?

[sean1982]

no that's not it, just getting fed up with that childish bickering that you seem to steer into every single time. We allready know that you think BruAir is the best airline in the world and that you are gods gift to aviations who had a meaning on everything pilots around the world do, yet seems to be flawless himself. Dead tiring is it, to read that pompous tone over and over again. If you think you're better then the rest of us, maybe you should go somewhere else

[RoMax]

no that's not it, just getting fed up with that childish bickering that you seem to steer into every single time. We allready know that you think BruAir is the best airline in the world and that you are gods gift to aviations who had a meaning on everything pilots around the world do, yet seems to be flawless himself. Dead tiring is it, to read that pompous tone over and over again. If you think you're better then the rest of us, maybe you should go somewhere else

I could agree, if the same couldn't be said about certain members when talking about RYR/CRL...

[sean1982]

true, and the same goes ...

[tolipanebas]

Did I refer to SN then?
Every single post I've made in this topic is related to the violation Ryanair committed, and to that alone.
Let me ask you what is your take on the matter then? Let's discuss the facts, not the persons discussing them, shall we?

[sean1982]

I allready discussed the fact and I think everything was said, the court will decide further. There was no need for that last post you made, as usual

[tolipanebas]

I am not allowed to link to a source stating FR is paying the usual fees now?
I am not allowed to elaborate on the 2 possibilities leading to them being in violation us the rules up until last month?

[sean1982]

Calling an airline that makes half a billion euro profit a year incompetent is ludicrous and is just there to provoke another stupid discussion with azuxtror.

The fact that they are paying the normal fees now, leads to the most probable cause which will is that it was a genuine mistake (as the flexi-weight practice is perfectly normal everywhere else in europe) They have been advised, they have adapted and they will see in court how much they have to pay. Case closed.

[tolipanebas]

Calling an airline that makes half a billion euro profit a year incompetent is ludicrous and is just there to provoke another stupid discussion with azuxtror.

The fact that they are paying the normal fees now, leads to the most probable cause which will is that it was a genuine mistake (as the flexi-weight practice is perfectly normal everywhere else in europe) They have been advised, they have adapted and they will see in court how much they have to pay. Case closed.

Was it really a mistake? Or was it done on purpose?
THAT is a genuine question to ask in the case of such a large airline which is so successful commercially, as both cases are not very flattering professionally.

[sean1982]

a business is never flattering .... the court will decide what it was

[tolipanebas]

the court will decide what it was

That's likely indeed.

BTW- are you sure Germany is such a big exception as you think it is? Up until this afternoon, you thought it was perfectly okay there too. Without wanting to sound pompous, I can tell you your management will be in for quite a surprise with their flex weight scheme. Just because it is allowed to be used, doesn't mean it also has to have any financial benefits, you know?

[OO-ITR]

Calling an airline that makes half a billion euro profit a year incompetent is ludicrous and is just there to provoke another stupid discussion with azuxtror.

Yes and it's no longer a secret anymore how they obtain this billion profit.
Strangly enough media bringing bad news on other airlines are telling the truth. Media bringing bad news on RYR are bad journalists and people commenting on it are RYR bashers. You have to decide in life and not being hypocrit!
Maybe YOU should read your posts afain and reflect on YOUR tone before blaiming others.

[RoMax]

Yes and it's no longer a secret anymore how they obtain this billion profit.
Strangly enough media bringing bad news on other airlines are telling the truth. Media bringing bad news on RYR are bad journalists and people commenting on it are RYR bashers. You have to decide in life and not being hypocrit!
Maybe YOU should read your posts afain and reflect on YOUR tone before blaiming others.

A little bit what I ment with my reaction, tough I was 'a bit' more indirect..

[sean1982]

According to Eurocontrol (Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) on route charges | EUROCONTROL):

"The MTOW declared should be the maximum certificated take-off weight of the aircraft. In the case of multiple certificated take-off weights, the MTOW to be declared must be the highest weight authorised by the State of registration."

And as in Ireland everytime an engineer assigns a new MTOW to the aircraft (according to Boeing procedures) that will be the highest weight authorised for that airplane. In other words, if an engineer changes the weight of the airplane to 66.990kg that will be the highest authorised weight for the IAA untill it gets changed again.

[sean1982]

Calling an airline that makes half a billion euro profit a year incompetent is ludicrous and is just there to provoke another stupid discussion with azuxtror.

Yes and it's no longer a secret anymore how they obtain this billion profit.
Strangly enough media bringing bad news on other airlines are telling the truth. Media bringing bad news on RYR are bad journalists and people commenting on it are RYR bashers. You have to decide in life and not being hypocrit!
Maybe YOU should read your posts afain and reflect on YOUR tone before blaiming others.

I still have to read the first factual post from you

In fact I'm the first one to admit when FR makes mistakes, and yes, I do not regard HLN.be good journalists. Furthermore the 3 people commenting on me here, are the only 3 FR bashers on the forum, 'nough said

[fcw]

Now also in Dutch:
http://www.standaard.be/Artikel/Detail. ... 9_00407350

No journo's nonsense after all it seems, fcw..

Still nonsense as they make it look FR used higher than allowed weights, which would be a safety issue.

You buy a BMW in Germany with 200hp, in Belgium the same car is sold with another chip limiting it to 150HP.
You buy and install the Belgiam chip and pay road tax according to these 150HP. The taxman says no you have to pay according the 200. That is what happened.You also have to note that most countries accept this technique.