Troubles at Brussels Airlines ? Part II

[Robertcarion]

I don't fully agree, and here is why. Its true that on most EU flights the crew of Bru.air are from DAT, except on the A319 where many pilots are actually both A319 and A330 type rated, and most of those double rated pilots first flew on the 330 before also flying on the 319. As you know many pilots of the 330 came from Sabena and trust me, these pilots got top-notch training with for many of them 20 to 30 years experience, and I don't have to recall the safety records held by Sabena and the reputation of its flight training. Its not that I wouldn't trust Ryanair pilots, but at Bru.air I know who is in the front seat and I have never had a single doubt about their ability to conduct flights safely. I prefer Bru.air, thats simply it.

[ttubbie]

I have not waited for these endless negotiations as I need to catch a flight at LGW this weekend. I have booked us on Eurotunnel, so if they decide to go on strike anyway, I will have an alternative to catch my connecting flight.

One more thing : this will be my last booking with BruAir.

[euroflyer]

I think the greatest problem on the Bru.air profitability is its uneconomical fleet of Avro's.
Operating almost all short-haul on Avro's, even B.Light flights, how could that possibly be profitable? Avro's can be profitable on all-business flights like VLM is starting to do. Or maybe in Africa as STOL (Short take-off & landing) aircraft.

A 112 seat Bae 146-300 a bit more than 1000gal/hour.
A 185-seat B-737-800 burns a bit less than 1000gal/hour

Acquisition costs of the Bae is much lower than that of the B737 but economics on a long run are way better.

"even on b.light flights" There are just bru.air flights. You can than choose between b.light and b.flex as service classes, but it is till the same fligt!

Your calculation about efficiency has one big mistake You will only have a more efficient 737-800, if you can fill the additional seats If you have the same number of pax on a plane burning "a bit more than 1000gal/h" and in a plane "burning a bit less than 1000gal/h" and the first plane is ways cheaper in acquisition costs, than this one, i.e. the AVRO's, might be cheaper over all

And as long, as bru.air is not able to fill an Avro 100 for the 8h15 departure from FRA to BRU there is no point in having more seats available ... (and please, believe me, I have done that leg as pax more than 15 times during the last 12 months with SN/bru.air and I have during the same time had more than 25 flights with LH on the same route at the 07h20 and 09h20 departures: SN usually about 40 pax, LH nearly always more or less fully booked A320/A321 )

[euroflyer]

Many people here seem to forget that Bru.air and SN Brussels are different companies.
Bru.air will not rebook your B.Light ticket. Forget that, it is clearly stated in their policies. I know that SN Brussels rebooked you if you missed a flight.
They are not "passionate about you" anymore...

Well, sorry again, I had the opposite experience last week . They were passionate about me. Even if I was clearly too late at the airport (well this SeaFood fair traffic was horrible ) and it was clearly my fault, they still managed to get me on the flight by calling the gate and make them waiting for me. OK, I was in b.flex, but still, with bru.air you have this possibility. Would never work with FR or EZ

[euroflyer]

Sorry, time for me to chip in... HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST THAT THOSE OF US IN OFFICE ROLES HAVE NOT ALSO HAD TO DO MORE HOURS, LOOSE BREAKS, WORK OUT HOLIDAYS, LOOSE LEAVE!!!!!!!!

Times have changed ... May not be nice, I can agree to this, but shortening of working hours, number of breaks, number of holidays, level of pay etc. etc. simply went a bit too far in many West-European countries during the 80s and 90s. And that is not just in Belgium However, I have to admit in other countries trade unions seem to be more pragmatic about this and see the need for change too. And if you want to influence the change, you have to be one of the active players, not the one crying "STOP the game" from the edge of the playing field

And to those of you always claiming bru.air would be the "airline with the lowest salaries in Europe", hm, be careful nowadays, I would not be sure if you compare your salaries (yes, and your standard of living) to those of colleagues from Latvia, Bulgaria, Poland, Cyprus or maybe even Portugal or Greece This is all Europe as well and they do a good job everyday as well, not just France, Germany and the UK to compare

[fcw]

[

And to those of you always claiming bru.air would be the "airline with the lowest salaries in Europe", hm, be careful nowadays, I would not be sure if you compare your salaries (yes, and your standard of living) to those of colleagues from Latvia, Bulgaria, Poland, Cyprus or maybe even Portugal or Greece This is all Europe as well and they do a good job everyday as well, not just France, Germany and the UK to compare

Just for your info: Air Baltic, Latavia F/O 47€/block hour (70h= 3300€)
Capt 70€:h 4900€/month
Cyprus F/O: 5500€/month, this is more than the salary of a capt at BruAir.

[foxtrot_lima_yankee]

Euroflyer wrote:
OK, I was in b.flex

I m sure they will stay passionate about you in B-flex
But most of us book B.light as travellers.

The 737 is more efficient than the Avro, doesn t matter the number of pax carried. Lease rates of Avro's are a bit lower but I m sure that if you lease 30 738's you can get a good deal too...
And the greatest disadvange: the limited range of the AVRO.
You know why DAT managers like AVRO's?
Because DAT used to be established in Antwerp, which is suited for AVRO operation because of the short runway. In EBBR, these aircraft can touch&go 3 times on the full runway-length.
If you can t fill an AVRO why not lease some Embraer's or ATR's? they are way more efficient in that class of pax capacity...

[airazurxtror]

Flight International 17-23 April 2007 p.13

p.13:
Ryanair rushed descents take a dive

Action by Irish low-cost carrier following safety breaches brings dramatic reduction in risk on unstabilised approaches

Ryanair operational flight data monitoring shows the airline has eliminated unstabilised approaches after a run of four high-risk incidents between July 2005 and June 2006(...)Ryanair's chief pilot Capt Ray Conway says a series of internal measures has resulted in a dramatic decline in rushed approaches.
The OFDM has recorded no unstabilised approaches since a warning from the airline's board on 25 September last year.The board (...) issued an unprecedented warning in a letter to pilots.(...)The letter also reminded pilots that go-arounds were considered a "no-blame" decision.(...)
The OFDM has had a generally beneficial effect on operations quality assurance at Ryanair since it was adopted fleet-wide in May 2004.

Is there a OFDM at Bru.air?

I have seen no answer until now.
Is there an Operational Flight Data Monitoring fleet-wide at Brussels Airlines, like at Ryanair for example?

[EBBR_Based]

Foxtrot_lima_yankee: are you actually stirring this up on purpose? You might have your "sources" within the SFA, but you clearly don't have the right background to teach a lesson to all involved at Brussels Airlines.

Practically all your claims in this topic have been countered already, and you keep on inventing arguments to convince us why Brussels Airlines is bad.

This topic has gone down the drain with false accusations, "facts" without any real source, hearsay, etc.

If anybody of the crew agrees, feel free to close this topic. It doesn't make sense to keep this playground open.

[blackhawk]

Everyone had it's say in this topic, last 2 pages where getting off topic.

I will open a new Brussels Airlines - part III topic, but please don't go off topic!