Syrian Air discontinuing Amsterdam and Brussels?

[MEA707]

Syrian Air service to Amsterdam disappears after May 28 and Brussels disappears after May 22 in the schedules.

Can anyone confirm that they are discontinuing these two destinations?

Regards

[themole]

Syrian Air service to Amsterdam disappears after May 28 and Brussels disappears after May 22 in the schedules.

Can anyone confirm that they are discontinuing these two destinations?

Indeed, Syrian Arab Airlines seems to be pulling out of the Benelux market. By 'coincidence', Etihad Airways will start its Brussels operations around that period of time. Via Abu Dhabi they offer connections to Beirut (4x weekly) and Damascus (3x weekly), for those who are interested. Much will depend on the Etihad Airways schedules of course, more info on that later.

[Established02]

Via Abu Dhabi they offer connections to Beirut (4x weekly) and Damascus (3x weekly), for those who are interested.

AUH seems to be a bit out of the way to consider it as a convenient connecting point for the more mediterranean destinations.

According to http://www.airportcitycodes.com/calcform.aspx.

BRU-BEY 04:43 Block Time

BRU-AUH 07:25 and AUH-BEY 03:00 => BRU-AUH-BEY 10:25 Block Time

[themole]

AUH seems to be a bit out of the way to consider it as a convenient connecting point for the more mediterranean destinations.

According to http://www.airportcitycodes.com/calcform.aspx.

BRU-BEY 04:43 Block Time

BRU-AUH 07:25 and AUH-BEY 03:00 => BRU-AUH-BEY 10:25 Block Time

I fully agree. But for a bargain fare, some people are certainly prepared to fly with Etihad Airways via Abu Dhabi, on condition that the schedules allow it of course.
By the way, the Syrian and Lebanese markets are no target.

[SN30952]

Etihad Airways will start its Brussels operations around that period of time. Via Abu Dhabi they offer connections to Beirut (4x weekly) and Damascus (3x weekly), for those who are interested.

What a backtrack:
BRU-BEY is roughly 3144 km and a flight of 4hours.
BRU-DXB-BEY is 7273 km that's more than double the distance, and in the best conditions that would be a flying time of 9hours, not taking in to account a transit time.
Who would be interested?

[C_J]

What a backtrack:
BRU-BEY is roughly 3144 km and a flight of 4hours.
BRU-DXB-BEY is 7273 km that's more than double the distance, and in the best conditions that would be a flying time of 9hours, not taking in to account a transit time.
Who would be interested?

I agree with you! Maybe they can use a parachute when flying over Syria
How was Syrian Air doing on these routes?
Very sad, I liked their planes...

[themole]

What a backtrack:
BRU-BEY is roughly 3144 km and a flight of 4hours.
BRU-DXB-BEY is 7273 km that's more than double the distance, and in the best conditions that would be a flying time of 9hours, not taking in to account a transit time.
Who would be interested?

Why is it so difficult to get passed Belgium for a second? I wasn't even thinking about Belgian or European pax, but about the Etihad Airways Canadian pax. If they are prepared to fly the Toronto - Abu Dhabi sector via Brussels, why wouldn't they be prepared to fly beyond Abu Dhabi? What's a few more hours if pax are prepared to fly about 15 hours to Abu Dhabi anyway, on top of the fact that they pay less, and get a better service than they would get by flying with another airline. Etihad Airways offers Canadian pax - especially the many Asian expats - an excellent and convenient product to the Middle-East and beyond. Do you really think that if pax want to connect with Etihad Airways via Abu Dhabi, that they care if they would have to fly another - f.e. 3 hours - to the North, East, South or West of Abu Dhabi? You would be surprised how many pax don't fly the most convenient or logical routings ...

[SN30952]

I wasn't even thinking about Belgian or European pax, but about the Etihad Airways Canadian pax. If they are prepared to fly the Toronto - Abu Dhabi sector via Brussels, why wouldn't they be prepared to fly beyond Abu Dhabi? f.e. 3 hours - to the North, East, South or West of Abu Dhabi? You would be surprised how many pax don't fly the most convenient or logical routings ...

Read this one: Air Canada: Toronto - Beijing non-stop 4 times weekly
Air Canada will offer customers up to 13 non-stop flights per day* in each direction between Canada and eight destinations in Asia:
From Toronto to Hong Kong, Tokyo, Seoul and Delhi.
From Vancouver Air Canada serves Hong Kong, Shanghai, Beijing, Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya and Seoul with daily non-stop flights.
13 non-stop flights per day* in each direction means 13 X 7 x 2 = 182 flights weekly...."
And India is in the make.
182 direct flights beyond the 'arab' countries....
I do not see clearly why Canadians should transit in the Middle East if they can reach their destinations Non-Stop. And who wants the troubles when disembarking from the ME in North America? There are shorter and friendlier queues at immigration.

Btw ethnic travel will account for less than 18%:
The CIA factbook:
Canadians are Roman Catholic 46%, Protestant 36%, other 18% (this including many Chinese & Indians)

There must be a good reason why Syrian Air is discontinuing Amsterdam and Brussels: Westerners, Christians are not welcome in that part of the world. Who wants to get killed overthere, (and it's getting dangerous enough at home, with these guys?) I say, the Arabs have to clean up their store, before doing business.
You would be surprised how many pax think like this.....

[themole]

Read this one: Air Canada: Toronto - Beijing non-stop 4 times weekly
Air Canada will offer customers up to 13 non-stop flights per day* in each direction between Canada and eight destinations in Asia:
From Toronto to Hong Kong, Tokyo, Seoul and Delhi.
From Vancouver Air Canada serves Hong Kong, Shanghai, Beijing, Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya and Seoul with daily non-stop flights.
13 non-stop flights per day* in each direction means 13 X 7 x 2 = 182 flights weekly...."
And India is in the make.
182 direct flights beyond the 'arab' countries....
I do not see clearly why Canadians should transit in the Middle East if they can reach their destinations Non-Stop. And who wants the troubles when disembarking from the ME in North America? There are shorter and friendlier queues at immigration.

Btw ethnic travel will account for less than 18%:
The CIA factbook:
Canadians are Roman Catholic 46%, Protestant 36%, other 18% (this including many Chinese & Indians)

For starters and out of personal experience, Air Canada offers a very average - or should I say poor - product. And even if Air Canada provides a non-stop airlink, so what? Pax are not prepared to fly non-stop at any cost or with any carrier.

Brussels is a perfect illustration in this matter. In the past decades, beloved R.I.P. Sabena tried to build an intercontinental network. They offered several non-stop and direct links out of Brussels to many continents, often without online competition. How come that they failed then? Not necessarily because the Belgian market is too small. Markets like The Netherlands, Switzerland, Austria, Scandinavia, etc ... are not that much bigger, but yet they succeeded. Let's not get into the details about the specific reasons of this failure, but one of the most important reasons is undoubtedly that Sabena made the wrong presumptions. It was wrong to presume that Belgian pax prefer to fly with their national carrier or non-stop out of Brussels, just out of patriotism or out of convenience. Sabena realized this too little too late ...

An example: sure people could have flown non-stop out of Brussels to Tokyo Narita, but unfortunately for Sabena not at any cost! Many pax connected via Amsterdam, Frankfurt, London, Paris, etc ... despite the non-stop Sabena airlink. Especially the much wanted high-yield pax didn't fly Sabena, simple because they weren't good enough in comparison to the competition. Sabena got stuck with the leisure and low-yield pax, making Tokyo Narita a financial drain, even though the loads were satisfactory. Due to strategic reasons, Tokyo Narita remained a Sabena destination for many years. Many intercontinental Sabena destinations went down the toilet in almost exactly the same way.

Also many intercontinental airlines tried to serve Brussels non-stop or direct, but most of them failed. The Brussels market needs a feeder concept, and this is exactly what intercontinental carriers lacked or lack in Brussels. A strong home carrier can play an important role in this concept. Unfortunately Sabena never was a strong home carrier, and SN Brussels Airlines isn't either and never will be. Now that many big intercontinental airlines have joined a global alliance, they will use the alliance hubs as transfer hubs. I'm afraid, this means exit Brussels as potential new destination for most - if not all - of those carriers ...

The only hope for Brussels is to attract independent airlines and to promote Brussels as stopover destination. The Etihad Airways venture is a perfect and good example of this, I hope many more will follow.

There must be a good reason why Syrian Air is discontinuing Amsterdam and Brussels: Westerners, Christians are not welcome in that part of the world. Who wants to get killed overthere, (and it's getting dangerous enough at home, with these guys?) I say, the Arabs have to clean up their store, before doing business.
You would be surprised how many pax think like this.....

Again out of experience, Syrian Arab Airlines is a terrible airline!

Anyway, the remarks you made are very narrow-minded and insulting. Besides that, Arab carriers like Emirates, Qatar Airways and Etihad Airways are state-of-the-art airlines who are extremely successful and are envied by many.

It seems many people can learn a lot from the Arab business culture ... including you.

[Stoney]

can we please keep racism out of the forums guys? Everybody is entitled to his own opinion offcourse but I'm sure there's some arab people interested in aviation too who read this site and who are insulted now because of Fons' remarks...

No offence Fons, but I'm not interested in that, keep your comments about aviation please, that interests me and that is what this forum is about...

[sn26567]

Can we please keep racism out of the forums guys?

Endorsed by Luchtzak admins!

[Comet]

Fons I agree with some of the points you are making.

[SN30952]

Fons I agree with some of the points you are making.

It's really a pitty, but some people think they can insult the others freely, including the Belgians & their past airline, Sabena.
Tell me, my daily TV News for weeks, month and years is not what's happening in the ME....

Some people can trow mud at everyone, but when confronted with pure facts, they seem to be indignated and monopolise the forum, and then they think the have a license to kill.

But they don't have the guts to show their name, or to speak with open visor. Is that a way of doing business?

Concerning the welcome: VISIT VISA
The Cabinet has decided to reduce the visit visa period for citizens of 33 countries who are allowed to enter the UAE without a prior visa to one month non-renewable instead of three months. The Cabinet also decided to impose a charge of Dhs100 per visa to be collected on entry to the UAE through land, seaport and airport entry points.
The decision includes citizens from France, Italy, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Austria, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Portugal, Ireland, Greece, Cyprus, Finland, Malta, Spain, Monaco, Vatican, Iceland, Andorra, San Marino, Liechtenstein, United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, Brunei, Singapore, Malaysia and Hong Kong.
Citizens of the UK (with right of abode in the UK) will be granted a free of charge visit visa on arrival in the UAE
Who is making differences? Some (nationalities) are not allowed in....on basis of race?
That about racism.
Read it in http://www.uaeinteract.com/travel/visas.asp

For the queues in North American gateways, I do not even bother to detail.

[themole]

It's really a pitty, but some people think they can insult the others freely, including the Belgians & their past airline, Sabena.

Insult Belgians & Sabena freely? Please elaborate, because I honestly do not know what kind of insults you mean. If you are referring to me - who else? -, then I have to disappoint you. I will not apologize for sharing my opinions, especially not when they are based on the economic reality and not on sentiment, gossip or primitive internet research. I always use proper arguments when I try to make a point, I do not take a swing at somebody just for fun. If you want to aim at me personally, go ahead. But don’t be surprised if I strike back.

Tell me, my daily TV News for weeks, month and years is not what's happening in the ME....

Apparently, all Middle-Eastern nations are alike in your opinion. You don’t seem to make any distinction between countries like Israel, Palestina, Lebanon, Iraq or Iran and Syria, Jordan, Kuwait, Bahrain, Oman, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates, etc … It seems all those countries belong to the same category in your opinion. Well, shame on you! Maybe you better turn your TV off as from now on?

Some people can trow mud at everyone, but when confronted with pure facts, they seem to be indignated and monopolise the forum, and then they think the have a license to kill.

Again please elaborate. Pure facts? What facts? An Air Canada timetable and CIA statistics? Sorry, but those are not the kind of references used by airline professionals. Do you really think that important and relevant intra-professional information can be found on the internet? Think again. But please proceed with your search, as you seem to have enough time on your hands.

Monopolize the forums? I have 58 posts, at the time of writing, you have 2697! The 'top 10 posting users' of this forum posted 45 % of the total amount of messages ever posted on these forums. You are number 5 in this ranking, with 4% of the total amount of posts. You are also number 4 in the ‘most active posters of January 2005’ ranking, with 11% of the total amount of posts. But don’t worry, you are the number 1 in the ‘most active posters of the past week’ ranking, with 20% of the total amount of posts. And more importantly, you are the one and only number 1 in the ‘users who created the most topics’ ranking, with 12% of all topics ever created. Congratulations, Fons! Maybe you should consult one of your famous online dictionaries again, and search for the meaning of the word ‘monopoly’?
As far as the license to kill is concerned, as I always say: 'I may be a shark in a suit, but I only bite when I am hungry'. It is not smart to spill any blood in the ocean, Fons. It attracts sharks, weather they wear a suit or not …

But they don't have the guts to show their name, or to speak with open visor.

Oh please Fons, you are holding on to a very thin thread here. Apparently you ran out of aviation related arguments, so you tend to get personal? You are such a valuable member to this community, but apparently sometimes you seem to get lost in your ambition to ‘win’ every discussion. Unfortunately, this time you are not talking to a 20 year old non-experienced boy here. What you are trying to sell here is crap. Sharing opinions has nothing to do with identity. This is cyberspace, which is supposed to be anonymous anyway, so why bother to go public? So your name is Fons? Says who? You? Your name might as well be Jack, Peter, Steve, or even Pamela. Who knows, or better yet, who cares?

Is that a way of doing business?

Luchtzak is - mainly - a spotter community, not a place to conduct business. So what’s your point? By the way, let me tell you why I like being around here, when time permits. In life, there is only one way to get away with a ‘you can all go to hell’ attitude, and that’s when you have ‘you can all go to hell’ money. I have that kind of money, plenty of it. And God knows that this influences my professional and my private life, as well in a positive as in a negative way. But in an online community like this, your position on the social ladder, your financial status, your age, your sex, your profession, your native tongue, your nationality, your past, your name, etc … it all doesn’t matter, or better yet, it shouldn’t matter. If people want to go public, fine. That’s their prerogative. But I am not interested in going public. I already have enough people who lick my heels day in day out, just for who I am and what I can do for them. Being anonymous more or less guarantees me that people don’t reach out to me. That’s the way I like it and that’s the way I would like to keep it. So if you want to judge me, do it. But please try to base your remarks on interesting issues, and by thinking at least twice. Not out of frustration and from under a Thai palm tree or out of a Thai beer bar please.

Concerning the welcome: VISIT VISA
The Cabinet has decided to reduce the visit visa period for citizens of 33 countries who are allowed to enter the UAE without a prior visa to one month non-renewable instead of three months. The Cabinet also decided to impose a charge of Dhs100 per visa to be collected on entry to the UAE through land, seaport and airport entry points.
The decision includes citizens from France, Italy, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Austria, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Portugal, Ireland, Greece, Cyprus, Finland, Malta, Spain, Monaco, Vatican, Iceland, Andorra, San Marino, Liechtenstein, United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, Brunei, Singapore, Malaysia and Hong Kong.
Citizens of the UK (with right of abode in the UK) will be granted a free of charge visit visa on arrival in the UAE
Who is making differences? Some (nationalities) are not allowed in....on basis of race?
That about racism.
Read it in http://www.uaeinteract.com/travel/visas.asp

It is perfectly normal that in a politically troubled area, security and immigration procedures are tough & extensive. You should be grateful for that, it makes people feel safe despite all the troubles. So you claim that the United Arab Emirates is a racist nation? Shame on you! I have been conducting business in the United Arab Emirates for over 20 years now, and I never experienced a single problem. On the contrary, Emiratis - as the natives are called - are friendly, welcoming and very reliable people. Please talk aviation and keep your political views personal.

For the queues in North American gateways, I do not even bother to detail.

Please don’t, this discussion is going nowhere anyway.

[chunk]

Fons I agree with some of the points you are making.

It's really a pitty, but some people think they can insult the others freely, including the Belgians & their past airline, Sabena.
Tell me, my daily TV News for weeks, month and years is not what's happening in the ME....

Some people can trow mud at everyone, but when confronted with pure facts, they seem to be indignated and monopolise the forum, and then they think the have a license to kill.

But they don't have the guts to show their name, or to speak with open visor. Is that a way of doing business?

Concerning the welcome: VISIT VISA
The Cabinet has decided to reduce the visit visa period for citizens of 33 countries who are allowed to enter the UAE without a prior visa to one month non-renewable instead of three months. The Cabinet also decided to impose a charge of Dhs100 per visa to be collected on entry to the UAE through land, seaport and airport entry points.
The decision includes citizens from France, Italy, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Austria, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Portugal, Ireland, Greece, Cyprus, Finland, Malta, Spain, Monaco, Vatican, Iceland, Andorra, San Marino, Liechtenstein, United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, Brunei, Singapore, Malaysia and Hong Kong.
Citizens of the UK (with right of abode in the UK) will be granted a free of charge visit visa on arrival in the UAE
Who is making differences? Some (nationalities) are not allowed in....on basis of race?
That about racism.
Read it in http://www.uaeinteract.com/travel/visas.asp

For the queues in North American gateways, I do not even bother to detail.

Dear oh dear this thread is desperately sad. Lucky we all believe everything we read in the press and see on tv - not. Europe and the US are STILL two of the most racist societies on this planet (I'm not going to jsutify that remark - do some research and know your facts) so don;t start spouting off about how racist the ME is. It is a problem that blights everywhere - part of the problem being an unwilingness to accept alternative cultures, religions and people. That is not their problem - its yours. People in the UAE, Qatar, Kuwait, Bahrain, Oman - even Iran are incredibly welcoming and go out of their way to be hospitable. I have no reason to believe it is any different in other Arab countries - with the excpetion of Iraq. Frnakly - we started it so it is difficult to complain about being shot at when we murdered so many of their citizens. The real problem is a lack of education in the US and EU - that is why we get IGNORANT comments from people that really should no better. There appears to be a few bigots logging in here (justifying bigotry 'cos someone slagged off your dead airline??? what the hell...) which is a pity 'cos it seemed such a friendly place before.

As for the block of text above regarding charging some nationalities for visas and not others? SO WHAT?? This happens everywhere - it all depends on the individual agreements governments have with other governements. I have to pay an entry visa for Bahrain, someone from Kuwait doesn't - is that racism? Of course not - just different relationships with different countries? Do you have the same relationship with everyone you know? No you don't. Let's end this b*llsh*t and add comments when we know what we are talking about eh? Think I'll not bother with the trip report to Bahrain last week then....

[Comet]

I do not base my statement on race at all, I really don't give a sh*t what colour someone is! But some places in the Middle East are classed as unsafe for visitors. You cannot argue with that, it is a fact. The Foreign Office often advises against travel to certain parts of the Middle East.

And as for lack of education in Europe and America, why are we Brits always told we should learn more about the way of life of people who come and live in our country? Surely if they CHOOSE to come and live in the UK then it is THEY who have a duty to learn the English language and way of life, not the other way round! That is the cause of so much racial intolerance - the bloody political correct brigade. I am English, I live in England and I communicate in the English language. I object to being branded as a racist purely because I expect those who choose to live in the UK to do the same!

And for the argument that we murder so many of their citizens, have you forgotten how many innocent people have been killed by hijackers, terrorists and suicide bombers purely in the name of religion? It is not us who need educating in morals and how to behave, it is those who strap explosives to their bodies, board school buses and kill everyone on board in the name of religion.

I am sorry but I will have my say - after all the politically correct lobby always make sure they have theirs, but they deny the right of free speech to anyone who does not agree with their left wing, woolly minded liberal do gooding attitudes.

[Rago]

Maybe we can split this topic in 2 : the part about Syrian Air and a part about the "so called" racism...

@ Fons : nevertheless what some people say, you're not talking kak (= South african expression). And what you were saying isn't considered as "racism". (definition of the word : racism is a trendy word mostly abused by leftwing-orientated individuals to impose their thoughts to the rest of the population)

[chunk]

I do not base my statement on race at all, I really don't give a sh*t what colour someone is! But some places in the Middle East are classed as unsafe for visitors. You cannot argue with that, it is a fact. The Foreign Office often advises against travel to certain parts of the Middle East.


And as for lack of education in Europe and America, why are we Brits always told we should learn more about the way of life of people who come and live in our country? Surely if they CHOOSE to come and live in the UK then it is THEY who have a duty to learn the English language and way of life, not the other way round! That is the cause of so much racial intolerance - the bloody political correct brigade. I am English, I live in England and I communicate in the English language. I object to being branded as a racist purely because I expect those who choose to live in the UK to do the same!


And for the argument that we murder so many of their citizens, have you forgotten how many innocent people have been killed by hijackers, terrorists and suicide bombers purely in the name of religion? It is not us who need educating in morals and how to behave, it is those who strap explosives to their bodies, board school buses and kill everyone on board in the name of religion.


I am sorry but I will have my say - after all the politically correct lobby always make sure they have theirs, but they deny the right of free speech to anyone who does not agree with their left wing, woolly minded liberal do gooding attitudes.

Those places in the Middle East will be the very ones that we have made unsafe then? Israel, Iraq, Afghanistan. The rest have no travel warnings on them. Look at the FCO website - just the usual crap about being vigilant. Which you will also find if you look up many parts of the US, Asia and South America.

I don't disagree with you that people coming here should be ENCOURAGED to learn English and understand local culture. No problem. That is why we live here though isn;t it? We have a choice with what we say and what we do - if people CHOOSE not to then it is up to them. My beef had nothing to do with this - it was the stereotyping of the entire Middle East as this dangerous hell hole war zone where you will be shot for being a westerner. Statements like that are plain dangerous not to mention completely wrong.

Erm....well done. You just agreed with my argument. How would you feel if someone good ole boy dropped missile after missile on your house? And then you get a mumbled apology if you are lucky?!! Don;t talk about morals - brainwashing appears everywhere its jsut those that are easily brainwashed are more desperate in some places than in others. The less you have to live for, the more likely you are to do something as crazy as a suicide mission. Hell we can't even sort out the hatred in N Ireland so what chance have we got with cultures we don;t know and for the most part (it seems) couldn;t care less about.

Who's denying freedom of speech here? You can say what you want - as can I. Not my fault if you don;t agree but aggression and uninformed hatred don;t get us anywhere. Don't assume that having an informed opinion makes a wooly left wing liberal. I just don;t like to see opinion based on what people see on tv news - which is by definition a fatally flawed information source.

[luchtzak]

Luchtzak-members,

after a discussion with the administrators we decided to close this topic.

Please feel free to open a new topic about 'Syrian Air discontinuing Amsterdam and Brussels'

thanks,

Bart