DHL expansion?
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At the moment: no solution yet, they (DHL) still hope for a final decission today. Germany is doing everything to attrack DHL.
The 2 chairmen of the committee are talking with Herman De Croo (this means they (government) are facing serious difficulties). According to Sigfried Brakke: "De val van de regering is nakend maar ... ." Now Brussels has invited again some DHL-representatives.
The 2 chairmen of the committee are talking with Herman De Croo (this means they (government) are facing serious difficulties). According to Sigfried Brakke: "De val van de regering is nakend maar ... ." Now Brussels has invited again some DHL-representatives.
The several governments are talking again. First they said it was impossible to reach an agreement, but now it's possible. The unions want 28.000 (charterts and cargo, no air force flights) nightflights, and it DHL will get the nightflights. It seems there is a agreement concerning an insulationprogram but this must be done before they reach 25000 nighflights. Our prime minister will declare everything around 17.30.
Last edited by blackhawk on 21 Sep 2004, 16:09, edited 2 times in total.
a birds eye view
If you're not used to "belgian situations' or if you residing outside Belgium, you can follow the 'situation' here of course.luchtzak wrote:Keep us up-to-date Blackhawk!blackhawk wrote:At 16h, again an "Extra Journaal".
But if your not in Belgium and
a- you have satelite
-Move to BVN (see coordinates on www.BVN.NL) for Nieuws in Flemish
-or to TV5 on the european bouquet. The 1930 News in broadcasted worlwide. www.TV5.ORG
b- you have Internet. No? 8O
-Teletext in Dutch: http://193.121.55.225/tt/tt.php?p=100&g=0&s=0&r=0&x=1
-Teletext in French, don't try RTBf Teletexte: La page 201 n'est pas disponible par Internet ! 8)
After all better stay on-line with Luchtzak, blackhawk will give you a birds eye view?
Unless Deutsche Welle has the news first!
(a birds eye viewmeaning: without too many details, of course)
Last edited by SN30952 on 22 Sep 2004, 00:19, edited 1 time in total.
Verhofstadt overkop in Gent: DHL oplossing niet voor meteen
Verhofstadt gaat overkop in Gent, lees in De Standaard
De premier is wel bij bewustzijn. De chauffeur was even buiten bewustzijn, maar is ook niet levensgevaarlijk gewond. Lees verder in Het Laatste Nieuws
No more info in other media.
De premier is wel bij bewustzijn. De chauffeur was even buiten bewustzijn, maar is ook niet levensgevaarlijk gewond. Lees verder in Het Laatste Nieuws
No more info in other media.
Last edited by SN30952 on 22 Sep 2004, 08:04, edited 2 times in total.
Prime minister Verhofstad had a caraccident this evening. The car, with the prime minster and his chauffeur in it, got of the road, and flipped up side down 4 times or so. Both the prime minister and his chauffeur were taken to the hospital but seem not to be lifethreatening wounded. First thoughts of course go to them, and i wish them a good recovery. Second thought is the following: How will this affect the negotiations about the plan for DHL that were planned for tomorrow? As there is a federal proposal, is it then only up to the Brussels and Flemish government, so that the accident of Verhofstad won't play a role? Or, what is my thought, is he still needed to play an important role in the ongoing negotiations? We'll see tomorrow...
EDIT: Damn Fons, you beat me to it 8) I'm too slow, i guess
Greets,
Pieter
EDIT: Damn Fons, you beat me to it 8) I'm too slow, i guess
Greets,
Pieter
Thanks for the news-update Fons, and thanks to Flybe for the translation!
Hopefully he will recover soon... BTW did you know that Verhofstadt lived 500 meters from my place in Mariakerke - Gent before I moved to Hofstade? I know that road by heart and I also know that that R4 (without lights) is the most tiring part for a driver. Just finished 35 minutes of E40 then some R4 is sometimes too much....
Hopefully he will recover soon... BTW did you know that Verhofstadt lived 500 meters from my place in Mariakerke - Gent before I moved to Hofstade? I know that road by heart and I also know that that R4 (without lights) is the most tiring part for a driver. Just finished 35 minutes of E40 then some R4 is sometimes too much....
In my opinion the Belgian Government can not decide that DHL will get more nightflights.
Why?
Because BRU is a fully coordinated airport. This means that airlines must have an airport slot to arrive at or depart from BRU. BRU is coordinated because the demand for capacity is higher that the capacity available(on certain momnets during a day). The number of nightflights is restricted due to environmental reasons (approved by the government). The Brussels slotcoordination office takes care of the allocation of nightslots to the airlines. They check constantly that the number of nightflight (movements) will not exceed the number of nightflights allowed. Nightflights is a scarce good.
If the government decides that the number of night movements will be higher, that does not mean that DHL get those nightslots. The European Union has made some rules about how to allocate slots to airlines. The EU is an open market, where clear and transparent competition is one the strong pillars.
My opinion is that when there are more nightmovements available (the actual discussion), those slots has to be distributed among all airlines who want to have nightslots. The slotcoordination will use the EU-rules for a clear, honest and transparent way of allocating those additional nightslots under the airlines (only those who wants to have nightslots).
If the Belgian government decides that extra nightflights must be allocated to DHL, they will get a hard time, because legally it is not allowed. Competition is not granted anymore. By the way, there is no distinction between freighters an passengers a/c with when allocating slots.
Airlines who want to have also additional nightflights can make a courtcase.
To be continued
Why?
Because BRU is a fully coordinated airport. This means that airlines must have an airport slot to arrive at or depart from BRU. BRU is coordinated because the demand for capacity is higher that the capacity available(on certain momnets during a day). The number of nightflights is restricted due to environmental reasons (approved by the government). The Brussels slotcoordination office takes care of the allocation of nightslots to the airlines. They check constantly that the number of nightflight (movements) will not exceed the number of nightflights allowed. Nightflights is a scarce good.
If the government decides that the number of night movements will be higher, that does not mean that DHL get those nightslots. The European Union has made some rules about how to allocate slots to airlines. The EU is an open market, where clear and transparent competition is one the strong pillars.
My opinion is that when there are more nightmovements available (the actual discussion), those slots has to be distributed among all airlines who want to have nightslots. The slotcoordination will use the EU-rules for a clear, honest and transparent way of allocating those additional nightslots under the airlines (only those who wants to have nightslots).
If the Belgian government decides that extra nightflights must be allocated to DHL, they will get a hard time, because legally it is not allowed. Competition is not granted anymore. By the way, there is no distinction between freighters an passengers a/c with when allocating slots.
Airlines who want to have also additional nightflights can make a courtcase.
To be continued
The federal government came up with a reasonable proposal (although it still ignores the most reasonable solution: concentration of flights instead of dispersion and insulation of houses).
But politician politics will undermine this proposal (The culprits will be easy to recognise: a food opportunity to torpedo Verhofstadt and take his place) and now that he lies in hospital, the solution will be delayed once more.
A solution could have been found in January. Why did the government let the situation rotten until now?
If I were DHL, I would have been packing a long time ago, direction Leipzig...
But politician politics will undermine this proposal (The culprits will be easy to recognise: a food opportunity to torpedo Verhofstadt and take his place) and now that he lies in hospital, the solution will be delayed once more.
A solution could have been found in January. Why did the government let the situation rotten until now?
If I were DHL, I would have been packing a long time ago, direction Leipzig...
André
ex Sabena #26567
ex Sabena #26567
Without anaesthesia that's why the insulation is needed.
Let's make it more graphical, Andre: Fingers (Copyrighted)sn26567 wrote:The federal government came up with a reasonable proposal (although it still ignores the most reasonable solution: concentration of flights instead of dispersion and insulation of houses).
Dispersion is like amputate a finger phalange by phalange without anaesthesia.
It hurts three times. 1x
, 2x , & 3x Concentration is in one time. 1x 8)
Without anaesthesia that's why the insulation is needed. 
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AFApresident
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- Joined: 01 Jun 2004, 00:00
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I have slept both in the Holiday Express BRU airport hotel, the Brussels Sheraton and the LAX Sheraton Airport hotel. And while these hotels are not located under the runway paths these hotels were all right at the airport (except for the Holiday Inn Express which is located in Diegem), nonetheless I didn´t have any troubles with sleeping.
So my question is the following are the people who are complaining just overexagerating and complaining because they don´t have anything else to do otherwise? Or is it really that loud
.
So my question is the following are the people who are complaining just overexagerating and complaining because they don´t have anything else to do otherwise? Or is it really that loud
.Hi AFAPresident (and also Destelbergenaar, I see, Destelbergen rocks!),
I live in Luxemburg City center now, right under the flightpath of passenger and cargo planes landing at Findel. Eurojets, Avro's, Fokkers, no problem at all, but I can assure you, if a Cargolux B747F is making its final descend, your entire flat is trembling, you have to put your TV-volume higher, you stop talking to your partner for a few seconds, and then life goes on... Findel is closed from midnight until 6 in the morning, but I can assure you, nothing spoils your Sunday morning more than a B747F in final descend at 06.05 am in the morning. Destelbergen has the occasional hot air balloon in summer, and not even F16s any longer, due to that court cause of the autistic boy who went mad in Zaffelaere each time a jet passed its house, so you (and me, when down in D'bergen in the weekends) are spared of this misery.
I tend to understand Noordrand/Oostrand and whatever other Rand people, since I am partly in the same situation (and boy, I like to sit in and to see a commercial or military jet from time to time). This whole DHL disaster all comes down to errors made 20-30 years ago when planning the residential and industrial zoning around the airport. It is too late know, and the proposed activity of DHL doesn't belong at BRU. If me, arm chair expert, were to decide, I would move the entire cargo business to Beauvechain: close enough to Brussels en highways, only country-side around, close enough to linguistic border to everyone's welcome to work there, and hey, those A-jets and Marchettis could easily move to Florennes or Kleine-Brogel, now that we are down-scaling the F16 fleet anyhow (or even better, to cazeaux in France). Just my two cents...
I live in Luxemburg City center now, right under the flightpath of passenger and cargo planes landing at Findel. Eurojets, Avro's, Fokkers, no problem at all, but I can assure you, if a Cargolux B747F is making its final descend, your entire flat is trembling, you have to put your TV-volume higher, you stop talking to your partner for a few seconds, and then life goes on... Findel is closed from midnight until 6 in the morning, but I can assure you, nothing spoils your Sunday morning more than a B747F in final descend at 06.05 am in the morning. Destelbergen has the occasional hot air balloon in summer, and not even F16s any longer, due to that court cause of the autistic boy who went mad in Zaffelaere each time a jet passed its house, so you (and me, when down in D'bergen in the weekends) are spared of this misery.
I tend to understand Noordrand/Oostrand and whatever other Rand people, since I am partly in the same situation (and boy, I like to sit in and to see a commercial or military jet from time to time). This whole DHL disaster all comes down to errors made 20-30 years ago when planning the residential and industrial zoning around the airport. It is too late know, and the proposed activity of DHL doesn't belong at BRU. If me, arm chair expert, were to decide, I would move the entire cargo business to Beauvechain: close enough to Brussels en highways, only country-side around, close enough to linguistic border to everyone's welcome to work there, and hey, those A-jets and Marchettis could easily move to Florennes or Kleine-Brogel, now that we are down-scaling the F16 fleet anyhow (or even better, to cazeaux in France). Just my two cents...
Hi,eurojet wrote: I tend to understand Noordrand/Oostrand and whatever other Rand people, since I am partly in the same situation (and boy, I like to sit in and to see a commercial or military jet from time to time). This whole DHL disaster all comes down to errors made 20-30 years ago when planning the residential and industrial zoning around the airport. It is too late know, and the proposed activity of DHL doesn't belong at BRU. If me, arm chair expert, were to decide, I would move the entire cargo business to Beauvechain: close enough to Brussels en highways, only country-side around, close enough to linguistic border to everyone's welcome to work there, and hey, those A-jets and Marchettis could easily move to Florennes or Kleine-Brogel, now that we are down-scaling the F16 fleet anyhow (or even better, to cazeaux in France). Just my two cents...
I understand your point of view. But I don't agree. First of all, how many of the families living in the 'Noordrand' have lived there for 20 or 30 years now and how many have moved there in more recent years with the cheaper livingprices in mind? Weren't they aware of the proximity of the airport?
If you went to check out your new apartment in Luxemburg, didn't you hear the planes coming over? If I go and live near a railroad, I can't complain either, unless they build the railroad in my backyard after I have moved there. And believe me, a freighttrain passing by at night can also make a building tremble.
In my opinion, those complaints come from all in all a few hundred people, a minority. While the majority of people don't complain at all and see the importance of a well stuctured national airport for a country. I even saw some people from the Noordrand reacting to those 'complainers' once in 'Man Bijt Hond'. They all said they loved the beautiful sight of a plane taking off and at night they slept well in their well isolated houses.
Secondly, moving to Beauvechain isn't an option for the DHL management. Brussels has their preference, and otherwise it will be Leipzig. And the people near Beauvechain would have a reason to complain because when they started living there, they didn't have nightflights.
grtz,
stroman
