Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by RoMax »

Yuqu12 wrote: 31 Mar 2017, 09:27 All in all, this makes it "perfect" for EW to take over SN, as they will have the exact same business model now: point to point connections at relatively low prices and then a long haul network (with some leysure destinations there). I think this step from SN (or LH) is a very clear indication that SN will merge into EW as they will start operating the same sort of connections.
Funny how people are now looking at some sort of hidden agenda with each and every single thing related to SN, while the question of SN to be integrated in Eurowings Group has been answered since December 2016. YES it will happen, EW and SN are now jointly working on it as we speak, the analsysis phase (mainly concerning the questions: where are the quick wins and how can we eventually come to a joint pan-European aviation group) is up to full speed. But that's a whole different question as to what will happen to the brand of SN on the long term (but some seem to see that as one single thing...), the SN name is here to stay for at least 2 years (agreed in the take-over deal), but as from that point nothing has been decided yet. As long as there is no better solution, which keeps the strengths of SN in the Belgian and African markets, it will stay Brussels Airlines. But keeping 'Brussels Airlines' doesn't mean we are not integrated in Eurowings Group as a company (while staying a seperate entity within the group), that is decided and both companies are working on that in a very good understanding right now. Despite the differences, both companies eventually have the same goals to achieve and both EW and SN can and will help each other achieving those.

The deal with Thomas Cook is a nice fit for Eurowings Group as well, but has nothing to do directly with that. SN has been working on a closer relationship with Thomas Cook for a very long time, after each year the relationship was expanded with more destinations and flights (scheduled and charter), while TCAB unfortunately became a victim of its own small size and the restructering of the Thomas Cook Group on an international scale. For LHG/EW it was as simple as saying "yes, let's do it" via their representation in the SN board. But that's not changing anything to the business model of SN as you seem to indicate Yuqu12. SN is simply expanding in a (very lucrative) market segment in which it has been rapidly growing for years now (especially since 2013-2014).

Let's not forget that the Belgian leisure and VFR market represents the vast majority of local air travel and there are also high yields to gain there besides the business market. For SN to structurally grow, remain competitive in the Belgian market and achieve it's own very ambitious targets, it needs to grow in more than one market segment. It's growing the traditional long haul market and related transfer traffic (Mumbai, etc.), it's growing in important short haul business markets with more capacity (Avro phase-out) and in some cases more frequencies, and it is growing on the very lucrative and relatively stable local leisure segment. That's part of the concept of the hybrid carrier. This strenghtens the position of SN here in Brussels much more than just expanding the BRU hub by increasing transfer traffic.
Any hub carrier, but especially the small ones, can lose their hub feed in an instant, because that traffic is not bound to your hub because of a strong local market. Guess why a group like AF-KL is so upset by the rise of the Gulf carriers. E.g. KLM's position is built on a huge transfer feeding network with a very important focus on Asia. They are now head-to-head with the Gulf carriers there. And no it are not the 2 daily EK flights to AMS that hurt KLM, it is the fact that EK (and the others) operate all over Europe and with that drain the feeding markets of KLM. KL seems to be relatively competitive for the moment (although still facing huge issues) thanks to the strong position they had built over the years, but for others it's something else. The treat of the Gulf carriers is an extreme example and concerns mainly the Europe-Asia market for the moment (where SN is hardly present, except for Mumbai now of course). But the idea is the same for all other major transfer focussed markets. You need to make sure you have a damn strong position to keep holding of new competitors when they start to go for your feeding markets. That's why many EU hub carriers are now so worried about carriers like Norwegian and WOW. They have a different strategy as the Gulf carriers, but the effect is the same, they have the potential to drain feed markets of the hub carriers by offering attractive non-stop capacity (Norwegian) or very cheap 1-stop capacity (WOW).

saratoga
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by saratoga »

Romax i dont contest what you are saying, i guess you well better informed than i am. But it is all strange to me to take over a company, not really know how to implement this and saying "let's see how it will develop within 2 years and then we can make a decision". They must have already some kind of plan.

crew1990
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Joined: 29 Dec 2010, 21:46

Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by crew1990 »

I was wondering something about Cabo Verde, when SN will fly there, wouldn't it be better to fly with a A330 with another destination in Africa, for example Banjul.

Day 1, BRU-BJL-SID-BRU
Day 3, BRU-BJL-BVQ-BRU
Day 5, BRU-BJL-SID-BRU
Day 6, BRU-BJL-BVQ-BRU

It would make that the crew wouldn't be stuck 3 or 4 days in Cabo Verde but only 1 or 2 days in Gambia?

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

crew1990 wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 11:28 I was wondering something about Cabo Verde, when SN will fly there, wouldn't it be better to fly with a A330 with another destination in Africa, for example Banjul.

Day 1, BRU-BJL-SID-BRU
Day 3, BRU-BJL-BVQ-BRU
Day 5, BRU-BJL-SID-BRU
Day 6, BRU-BJL-BVQ-BRU

It would make that the crew wouldn't be stuck 3 or 4 days in Cabo Verde but only 1 or 2 days in Gambia?
Would probably be better to go to CV first and then the hop to BJL, though this would impose a 2-hour delay to those flying to BJL.
BVC has a 2100-m RWY so maybe a bit short for a heavy to return straight to BRU.

While looking for info on BVQ/BVC, I found that the wiki page in Portuguese also had an issue with the Belgian national colours.
https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroporto_Boa_Vista-Rabil

Screenshot 2017-04-02 11.51.23.png

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by RoMax »

saratoga wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 10:15 Romax i dont contest what you are saying, i guess you well better informed than i am. But it is all strange to me to take over a company, not really know how to implement this and saying "let's see how it will develop within 2 years and then we can make a decision". They must have already some kind of plan.
There is big difference between a general strategy on what they way forward should be and a detailed plan. If you want to make sensible decisions as a company, you need to understand the business and that usually only happens after a full take-over when both companies can jointly work in full transparancy. That's why this phase is about analysis. Both EW and SN need to fully understand each other, not the big lines, the tiny little details. LHG wants to integrate SN in the EW Group as has been decided before the take-over and is happening as we speak, but there is no urgency whatsoever to change the SN brand. Currently the decision is: we keep the brand at least for the years to come. I can give you numerous examples of airline take-overs or even mergers, as well as take-overs outside the airline industry whereby the decision about the 'secondary' brand is only taken years after the full-takeover (with a phase of, at least for X years we keep it like it is).

SN has a strong brand recognition in some markets like Belgium and Africa (which happen to be quite important key markets obviously), but a weak one in many others. That makes it a complicated matter. Keeping the situation like it is today is fine, but eventually you need to better link the SN brand to the Eurowings brand as that's the point of a pan-European airline group which operates under a single platform. But everyone knows that fully phasing out the SN brand at this time would be suicide in Belgium and Africa. So it's normal that this decision is delayed, giving everyone at least 2 years to analyse how the brand could possibly evolve within the EW group but while keeping its strenghts in its key markets where SN is so well known.

So no it's definitely not a case like you describe it. It's a matter of having a general strategy on how to develop the group, working on an integration of SN within EW Group as planned and meanwhile taking a careful approach on the brand which can make or break the success of the company.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by sn26567 »

Homo Aeroportus wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 12:06 While looking for info on BVQ/BVC, I found that the wiki page in Portuguese also had an issue with the Belgian national colours.
https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroporto_Boa_Vista-Rabil
I just changed this ;)
André
ex Sabena #26567

crew1990
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by crew1990 »

This is the scheduled that I made from the booking engine of TCW for the winter season

Monday

9.00 BRU RMF 15.00
16.00 RMF BRU 20.35
9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
16.10 HRG BRU 20.35
8.50 BRU TFS 12.25
13.55 TFS BRU 19.15

Tuesday

7.50 BRU ACE 10.55
11.45 ACE FUE 12.20
13.20 FUE BRU 18.35
7.30 BRU TFS 11.05
12.35 TFS BRU 17.55

Wednesday

11.15 BRU LPA 14.40
16.10 LPA BRU 21.30
7.30 BRU TFS 11.05
12.35 TFS BRU 17.55

Thursday

9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
16.15 HRG BRU 20.40
8.15 BRU BVQ 12.35
13.35 BVQ SID 14.00
15.00 SID BRU 22.50
8.20 BRU TFS 11.55
13.25 TFS BRU 18.45

Friday

9.00 BRU RMF 15.00
16.15 RMF BRU 20.50
7.15 BRU ACE 10.20
11.10 ACE LPA 12.00
13.00 LPA BRU 18.20
13.15 BRU TFS 16.50
18.10 TFS BRU 23.30

Saturday

9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
19.10 HRG BRU 23.35
14.30 BRU AGA 17.20 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
18.20 AGA BRU 23.10 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
6.30 BRU TFS 10.05
11.35 TFS BRU 16.55
06.00 BRU NBE 08.35
9.35 NBE BRU 12.20

Sunday

08.05 BRU BVQ 12.25
13.15 BVQ SID 13.40
14.50 SID BRU 22.40
5.55 BRU ACE 9.00 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
9.55 ACE BRU 15.10 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
9.30 BRU LPA 12.55
14.25 LPA BRU 19.45

I guess most of those flights will be rescheduled on weekend days but we can already have an overview of the number on flights and the destinations which will be added to the network of Brussels Airlines for winter.

Marsa Alam 1---5--
Hurghada 1--4-6-
Tenerife 123456-
Gran Canaria --3-5-7
Lanzarote -2--5-7
Fuerteventura -2-----
Boa Vista ---4--7
Sal ---4--7
Agadir -----6-
Enfidha -----6-

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by RoMax »

I don't know if they will need to reschedule a lot to the weekend with this schedule as they'll have the two A320's of TCAB and normally they have some availability in their own fleet (like this winter OO-SSC was stored).
It will be interesting to see what happens after the first winter, summer 2018 will be interesting.

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

sn26567 wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 12:59
Homo Aeroportus wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 12:06 While looking for info on BVQ/BVC, I found that the wiki page in Portuguese also had an issue with the Belgian national colours.
https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroporto_Boa_Vista-Rabil
I just changed this ;)
Muito obrigado Senhor André !
:D

H.A.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by sn26567 »

An interesting comment by Max Oldorf, the Chief Commercial Officer of ch-aviation:

Back in December 2015, Jens Boyd, the Head of the Thomas Cook Group's Long Haul operations, was quoted by Bloomberg as saying the UK-based leisure giant would consider partnering Lufthansa's LCC initiative, Eurowings, should the project prove successful. This week, we finally got to know TCG's thoughts on that when it agreed to hive off its Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium (TCAB) carrier to Eurowings operator, Brussels Airlines.

With TCAB set to be wound down by year-end, Thomas Cook will switch to using Brussels Airlines as its capacity provider. The announcement came just days after CEO Peter Fankhauser reaffirmed Thomas Cook Group's commitment to its Condor unit despite recent hefty losses. With a restructuring plan now in full swing, the Group blamed Condor's former parent, Lufthansa, and its Eurowings unit for increased revenue pressure in key markets where they compete. It is interesting to note that Lufthansa Group reportedly approached Condor last year about it returning to the fold albeit as a member of, you guessed it, Eurowings.
André
ex Sabena #26567

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iMorris
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by iMorris »

sn26567 wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 19:07 An interesting comment by Max Oldorf, the Chief Commercial Officer of ch-aviation:

Back in December 2015, Jens Boyd, the Head of the Thomas Cook Group's Long Haul operations, was quoted by Bloomberg as saying the UK-based leisure giant would consider partnering Lufthansa's LCC initiative, Eurowings, should the project prove successful. This week, we finally got to know TCG's thoughts on that when it agreed to hive off its Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium (TCAB) carrier to Eurowings operator, Brussels Airlines.

With TCAB set to be wound down by year-end, Thomas Cook will switch to using Brussels Airlines as its capacity provider. The announcement came just days after CEO Peter Fankhauser reaffirmed Thomas Cook Group's commitment to its Condor unit despite recent hefty losses. With a restructuring plan now in full swing, the Group blamed Condor's former parent, Lufthansa, and its Eurowings unit for increased revenue pressure in key markets where they compete. It is interesting to note that Lufthansa Group reportedly approached Condor last year about it returning to the fold albeit as a member of, you guessed it, Eurowings.
:shock: :shock: That sure is interesting. Something has been "Cooking" for a while!

Forgive the pun.

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by convair »

crew1990 wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 13:42 This is the scheduled that I made from the booking engine of TCW for the winter season

Monday

9.00 BRU RMF 15.00
16.00 RMF BRU 20.35
9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
16.10 HRG BRU 20.35
8.50 BRU TFS 12.25
13.55 TFS BRU 19.15

Tuesday

7.50 BRU ACE 10.55
11.45 ACE FUE 12.20
13.20 FUE BRU 18.35
7.30 BRU TFS 11.05
12.35 TFS BRU 17.55

Wednesday

11.15 BRU LPA 14.40
16.10 LPA BRU 21.30
7.30 BRU TFS 11.05
12.35 TFS BRU 17.55

Thursday

9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
16.15 HRG BRU 20.40
8.15 BRU BVQ 12.35
13.35 BVQ SID 14.00
15.00 SID BRU 22.50
8.20 BRU TFS 11.55
13.25 TFS BRU 18.45

Friday

9.00 BRU RMF 15.00
16.15 RMF BRU 20.50
7.15 BRU ACE 10.20
11.10 ACE LPA 12.00
13.00 LPA BRU 18.20
13.15 BRU TFS 16.50
18.10 TFS BRU 23.30

Saturday

9.10 BRU HRG 14.55
19.10 HRG BRU 23.35
14.30 BRU AGA 17.20 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
18.20 AGA BRU 23.10 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
6.30 BRU TFS 10.05
11.35 TFS BRU 16.55
06.00 BRU NBE 08.35
9.35 NBE BRU 12.20

Sunday

08.05 BRU BVQ 12.25
13.15 BVQ SID 13.40
14.50 SID BRU 22.40
5.55 BRU ACE 9.00 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
9.55 ACE BRU 15.10 (Operated by Brussels Airlines)
9.30 BRU LPA 12.55
14.25 LPA BRU 19.45

I guess most of those flights will be rescheduled on weekend days but we can already have an overview of the number on flights and the destinations which will be added to the network of Brussels Airlines for winter.

Marsa Alam 1---5--
Hurghada 1--4-6-
Tenerife 123456-
Gran Canaria --3-5-7
Lanzarote -2--5-7
Fuerteventura -2-----
Boa Vista ---4--7
Sal ---4--7
Agadir -----6-
Enfidha -----6-
Obviously, for these 2 to 4 flights per day, the SN fleet (with the 2 additional aircraft from TCAB) offers more flexibility.
RoMax wrote: 02 Apr 2017, 13:59 I don't know if they will need to reschedule a lot to the weekend with this schedule as they'll have the two A320's of TCAB and normally they have some availability in their own fleet (like this winter OO-SSC was stored).
It will be interesting to see what happens after the first winter, summer 2018 will be interesting.
I agree that they won't need, and they probably don't wish, to reschedule all the "TCAB" flights to the weekend days. These 18 additional weekly flights (taking into account the triangular ones, but not those already operated by SN) would be quite a heavy burden on the fleet if spread over 2 or 3 weekend days only. However, they might of course decide to shift some of them.
It also depends on the agreements they have with the hotels I suppose.

Boeing767copilot
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Boeing767copilot »

SHS Aviation, the new owner of VLM, will take over some parts of HQ.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/vlm-air ... s-belgium/

lenain258
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by lenain258 »

Will Brussels Airlines become the TCAB carrier by adding its destinations and two of its planes or not? Thank you

Boeing767copilot
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Joined: 13 May 2004, 00:00

Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Boeing767copilot »

SHS Aviation (‘VLM Airlines’) Acquires the Remaining Part of Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Antwerp, Brussels (Belgium) – 31st May, 2017 • SHS Aviation B.V. has reached an agreement to acquire all shares of Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium N.V. (TCAB). Through the acquisition, SHS Aviation will take over certain contractual obligations as well as 40 ground staff employees of TCAB. SHS Aviation also expects to be using TCAB’s Air Operator Certificate (AOC) and Operating Licence. SHS Aviation B.V. is the Dutch holding company which will develop activities through its Belgian subsidiary SHS Antwerp Aviation N.V. under the brand name ‘VLM Airlines’.

Thomas Cook announced in March this year the initiation of a consultation process for 40 remaining ground staff employees of TCAB as part of an intended partnership between the tour operator Thomas Cook Belgium and Brussels Airlines where all crew and two aircraft are to be transferred to Brussels Airlines. The successful resolution to mitigate any ground staff redundancies is confirmed today in the acquisition of TCAB by SHS Aviation. Today, TCAB informed its employee representation of its intention to stop the collective consultation process.

Jean-Christophe Degen, Managing Director of Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium, said: “Today’s announcement is great news for our colleagues at TCAB. I’m very pleased that thanks to the agreement with SHS Aviation, we are able to safeguard the roles of all our ground staff employees.”

Harm Prins, CEO of SHS Aviation: “We are delighted to be able to acquire TCAB and to start working with its experienced staff members. Together we will write a new, exciting chapter in Belgian aviation. Although the acquisition of TCAB is bringing us closer to the implementation of our business plan, the application procedure with the Belgian Ministry of Mobility for a Belgian Fokker 50 AOC remains ongoing.”

SHS Antwerp Aviation and VLM Airlines d.d. will commence joint scheduled flights later this year under the common trading name ‘VLM Airlines’. Details regarding the number of aircraft to be used, planned routes and timetables will be announced at a later stage.

The acquisition deal will be closed upon completion of the extended partnership agreement between tour operator Thomas Cook Belgium and Brussels Airlines, which is plannedend of October, 2017.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/vlm-air ... s-belgium/

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by RoMax »

Interesting deal and an easy way for them to acquire the basis of an already existing, operating, certified airline. As SN is only taking over the flight crew and two aircraft (and the activities via a contract with Thomas Cook as the tour operator), but not TCAB as such (and neither the ground staff). Seems like a good deal for both SHS/VLM and the staff remaining at TCAB not being taken over by SN.

Bralo20
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Bralo20 »

RoMax wrote: 31 May 2017, 18:43 Interesting deal and an easy way for them to acquire the basis of an already existing, operating, certified airline. As SN is only taking over the flight crew and two aircraft (and the activities via a contract with Thomas Cook as the tour operator), but not TCAB as such (and neither the ground staff). Seems like a good deal for both SHS/VLM and the staff remaining at TCAB not being taken over by SN.
It might also suggest that they have doubts about getting an AOC...

convair
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Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by convair »

DeltaWiskey wrote: 03 Jun 2017, 08:18 I find it strange that you all seem to think: more and stricter rules = better (but not necessarily safer). It works anti-competitively, certainly in aviation. As we all know competition is good for the customers, but also the companies themselves. Brussels Airlines did a good job in re-inventing itself when it was attacked by the LCC's in recent years.
Sure, competition is good for the customers. But that is valid for all commercial activities and almost all of them do have access conditions nowadays; these are also good for the customers as they constitute an elemental protection.

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Yuqu12
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Re: Brussels Airlines takes over Thomas Cook Airlines Belgium

Post by Yuqu12 »

I study law, so I can tell what I saw in enterprise law. A financial plan has to be handed in at the office of a notary. However, this should be kept there and the business plan is only to see if someone is to blame when a starting cooperation goes bankrupt within 3 years after it started. I am however not sure whether this financial plan can be asked by the BCAA as such.

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