Brussels region noise regulation

[lumumba]

So the prime minister took over...

Exactly let's hope he can move things.

[jan_olieslagers]

I see little hope: what more can he say than has already been said? 60.000 jobs at stake, many of them low-profile, exactly what Brussels badly needs... every bit of common sense seems lost... poor country indeed.

Wat baten kaars en bril, als den uil niet zien en wil?

[Passenger]

Remarkable day. With his press release "illegal because not presented to the European Commission", Kris Peeters (CD&V) has blocked the possibility for the government of the Brussels Capital Region to collect fines after 22th February 2017. One of the members of that Brussels government is Bianca Debaets, also CD&V. Although mrs Debaets gained as little as 2.288 (2-2-8-8) votes at the 2014 election, she became secretary of State in the Brussels government. She has no backup from voters, and she is now handcuffed: if the Brussels government will indeed collect fines, the political opposition will kill her, the CD&V and Kris Peeters for their double standards. So there is only one way out for Debaets: she must convince her fellow ministers to put the file on hold.

Luckily, and by coincidence, federal prime minister Charles Michel came to rescue today: with his speech in parliament, he has forced his minister for Transport (Bellot and Michel are member of the same party) to finalize the Vliegwet - Aviation Law. And with his statement, prime minister Michel also makes it clear that the federal government will call a next conflict of interest if the Brussels government doens't want to negociate.

[ZavCity]

As said before, the two items ("vliegwet" and "noise restrictions") are regulated by 2 different governments, the first =National, the second = regional....So a new "vliegwet" has nothing that can help..Problem is politics, BRussels French talking politics=CDH/PS and are against MR!! so little hope indeed for a positive solution, you ave to change the constitution to make everything NATIONAL again!
gtz
paul

[lumumba]

I see little hope: what more can he say than has already been said? 60.000 jobs at stake, many of them low-profile, exactly what Brussels badly needs... every bit of common sense seems lost... poor country indeed.

Wat baten kaars en bril, als den uil niet zien en wil?

I only see hope but like the prime minister said everybody will have to put some water in his wine...

I think that the idea to extend the landing runway and make it also possible to take off from there is a good idea.

[jan_olieslagers]

Sorry to enter politics again ( I already have to plead guilty - but how is this to be avoided in this very peculiar case? ) but there is hope in the previous statement

the federal government will call a next conflict of interest if the Brussels government doens't want to negociate.

Seems like some local potentates wanted to get the PM's attention, to make themselves as important as they could?

[StijnBRU]

I know we can not discuss politics, but there is nothing but politics on this.

I refer to the new article in de standaard today with Fremault... the only reaction I can have is pure disgust about the way this is played. Brussels has no intention of changing there position on the noice restrictions, this is purely based on the desire to be reelected again, especially CDH and FDF, which is still a pure flemish hating party.
Fremault has been giving the example of AMS were, she claims, the rules of a night curfew are strictly followed...a big lie, there are airlines, also cargo, with scheduled night departures eg SQ7395 D5 LHR-AMS-SHJ, departs at 02U00 in the morning.
It is time for the airport staff to speak much louder, we can not accept this as a community... a region that is taking us into hostage...

[Acid-drop]

How can you blame politics when they are doing exactly what the population ask ? Lets be serious...
If they are all nimby, they will get a nimby island. Good for them.

Brussels is left minded people and politics, probably because most right handed left (escaped ?) to live in the flemish brabant. No surprise now.

This is only the start, after that they will reduce the amount of lanes on the e40, on their part of the ring they will block the enlargement, etc.
You can disagree and blame them, but they have something right : they are very logic. And voters are happy.

a region that is taking us into hostage...

Funny. They say just the same.

One of the members of that Brussels government is Bianca Debaets, also CD&V. Although mrs Debaets gained as little as 2.288 (2-2-8-8) votes at the 2014 election, she became secretary of State in the Brussels government. She has no backup from voters, and she is now handcuffed: if the Brussels government will indeed collect fines, the political opposition will kill her, the CD&V and Kris Peeters for their double standards. So there is only one way out for Debaets: she must convince her fellow ministers to put the file on hold.

Indeed, CD&V and openvld are part of brussels gov so they are clearly part of this mess. They can't really have a double voice, can they ?

My idea on THE solution ?
A new track further east and stop flying over brussels.
We had a very interesting pdf posted a while ago
http://www.bruairlibre.be/_wp-balb/wp-c ... roport.pdf

From page 38 they talk about the options of BRU.
A must see.

[sn26567]

Words of wisdom by the CEO of Brussels Airlines Bernard Gustin: “I can not imagine that there is no solution possible for Brussels Airport which reconciles economic and environmental interests“.

Full interview: https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/brussel ... s-airport/

[Passenger]

According to the CD&V, the Brussels Capital Region has forgotten to communicate the technical details of their penalty system to the European Commission. The legislation thus is illegal, the CD&V says, and it will take Brussels 3 to 6 months to correct it with the EU.
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/regio ... /1.2886963

The Flemish press reports that the European Commission reports that they are unaware that the above issue is indeed an infract against European legislation, and that they (= the E.C.) therefore regard the noise regulation issue as an internal problem for Belgium.

[lumumba]

http://mobile.lesoir.be/1440529/article ... -bruxelles

That is a part of the solution Liege proposition to take over all the difficult flights ..
They can do it because they invested 500 million euros to make it possible...
I think that's good idea!

[korvo]

http://mobile.lesoir.be/1440529/article ... -bruxelles

That is a part of the solution Liege proposition to take over all the difficult flights ..
They can do it because they invested 500 million euros to make it possible...
I think that's good idea!

Negative! That's what they wanted from the start - nice try. I propose to turn Brussels into a big park and to build a new Bruxelles in the midst of the Ardennes. I think that's a good idea!

[BRU]

http://mobile.lesoir.be/1440529/article ... -bruxelles

That is a part of the solution Liege proposition to take over all the difficult flights ..
They can do it because they invested 500 million euros to make it possible...
I think that's good idea!

Why does nobody understand that the airlines choose the airport, not the airports or the governement. Seen the difficulties and restrictions to operate at Brussels already in place today, any airline that sees LGG as a solution would already have moved. So unless they make use of Belgian traffic rights or 5th freedom rights, do not see them moving to another Belgian airport...

[Acid-drop]

5th freedom right is obviously what we need. Desperately.
We (Belgium) already lost qatar cargo. How much more can we lose ?

[luchtzak]

Flemish minister of transport Ben Weyts announced that he will file a "conflict of interest" against the Brussels region noise regulations.

http://www.hln.be/hln/nl/942/Economie/a ... enen.dhtml

[sn26567]

There is one simple solution that can be implemented almost immediately: change the routes in order not to overfly Brussels

Don't forget that the Council of State upheld the position of the Brussels region. That might be the only way out of the issue.

Thus the Social and Economic Council of the Brussels Region proposed some reasonable solutions in seven points (one of them being the reactivation of the Ring route):

http://www.levif.be/actualite/belgique/ ... 14881.html

[luchtzak]

There is one simple solution that can be implemented almost immediately: change the routes in order not to overfly Brussels

But adapting the routes takes 1-2 years ?!

[lumumba]

There is one simple solution that can be implemented almost immediately: change the routes in order not to overfly Brussels

But that's also the problem nobody wants more over flying planes if they don't fly over Brussels they fly over Vlaams Brabant and they also refuse that....

If that is on the table than I'm sure Brussels will accept that but they don't ask so much if planes could take of from the two runways and like that you spread the noise it would be a solution.
But Zaventem said no already...

[Passenger]

When the political parties from the Brussels Capital Region indeed are going to kill Brussels Airport like they are planning to do, maybe the reaction from both Brussels Airport and Flanders will be much severe then Brussels ever thaught. Let's remain realistic: when the severe noise regulations are indeed applied, Brussels Airport will loose tremendous much business. So far, both Brussels Airport and Flanders remain polite: we invite them for negotiations, we politely discuss matter in court, we call a conflict of interest, limited in time. But Brussels better remember what Vandenboeyants once said: te veel is trop en trop is te veel. And they are really nearing te veel is trop.

1. we immediately kick out the 2 PS politicians from the board of Brussels Airport (Olivier Vanderijst and Benjamin Cadranel)

2. We cancel the bilangual (trilangual) status that Brussels Airport now has, and we implement the language rules from the territory where the airport is based. Flanders Region, Dutch language.

3. We demand fluent knowledge of Dutch for all people working at the airport, starting with the taxi drivers and ground handlers.

Flanders may also install noise restrictions for our rural areas near the language border. We thus can avoid that people Riemst and Tongeren suffer from 747 cargo aircraft taking off from LGG and climbing out over their houses:

[convair]

When the political parties from the Brussels Capital Region indeed are going to kill Brussels Airport like they are planning to do, maybe the reaction from both Brussels Airport and Flanders will be much severe then Brussels ever thaught. Let's remain realistic: when the severe noise regulations are indeed applied, Brussels Airport will loose tremendous much business. So far, both Brussels Airport and Flanders remain polite: we invite them for negotiations, we politely discuss matter in court, we call a conflict of interest, limited in time. But Brussels better remember what Vandenboeyants once said: te veel is trop en trop is te veel. And they are really nearing te veel is trop.

1. we immediately kick out the 2 PS politicians from the board of Brussels Airport (Olivier Vanderijst and Benjamin Cadranel)

2. We cancel the bilangual (trilangual) status that Brussels Airport now has, and we implement the language rules from the territory where the airport is based. Flanders Region, Dutch language.

3. We demand fluent knowledge of Dutch for all people working at the airport, starting with the taxi drivers and ground handlers.

Flanders may also install noise restrictions for our rural areas near the language border. We thus can avoid that people Riemst and Tongeren suffer from 747 cargo aircraft taking off from LGG and climbing out over their houses.

It would be sad to have to resort to that kind of guerilla but if nothing else works...

An amicable solution taking into account most of the legitimate claims of all parties should be possible and MUST be found.

Let's hope the Brussels region will listen to the very reasonable suggestions of its own Social and Economic Council.