Ryanair in 2015

[Passenger]

We have exactly the same score as SN on airlinequality.com ... Cant be as bad then

Airlinequality.com gives Ryanair 2 stars and Brussels Airlines 3 stars. I wouldn't call that "exactly the same":

The 2-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a lower Quality performance, below the industry Quality average across many of the rating sectors. A 2-Star Airline rating normally signifies poorer or inconsistent standards of Product and front-line Staff Service for the Cabin Service and the home-base Airport environment.

The 3-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a fair Quality performance that conforms to an industry “average” of acceptable product and service standards. The 3-Star Airline rating signifies a satisfactory standard of core Product for most travel categories (ie. cabin of travel), but it also reflects some inconsistency amongst either standards of front-line Staff Service or Product delivery for the Cabin Service and their home-base Airport environments.

[sean1982]

We have exactly the same score as SN on airlinequality.com ... Cant be as bad then

Airlinequality.com gives Ryanair 2 stars and Brussels Airlines 3 stars. I wouldn't call that "exactly the same":

The 2-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a lower Quality performance, below the industry Quality average across many of the rating sectors. A 2-Star Airline rating normally signifies poorer or inconsistent standards of Product and front-line Staff Service for the Cabin Service and the home-base Airport environment.

The 3-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a fair Quality performance that conforms to an industry “average” of acceptable product and service standards. The 3-Star Airline rating signifies a satisfactory standard of core Product for most travel categories (ie. cabin of travel), but it also reflects some inconsistency amongst either standards of front-line Staff Service or Product delivery for the Cabin Service and their home-base Airport environments.

Euhm ... 5/10 is 5/10 ... Those are the passengers thoughts.
Out of 25 stars to be earned SN has 1 more on food and beverage (and that doesnt even apply to short haul) so yeah .... You like to use airlinequality.com? There you have it

[OO-ITR]

We have exactly the same score as SN on airlinequality.com ... Cant be as bad then

Airlinequality.com gives Ryanair 2 stars and Brussels Airlines 3 stars. I wouldn't call that "exactly the same":

The 2-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a lower Quality performance, below the industry Quality average across many of the rating sectors. A 2-Star Airline rating normally signifies poorer or inconsistent standards of Product and front-line Staff Service for the Cabin Service and the home-base Airport environment.

The 3-Star Airline Rating is awarded to airlines delivering a fair Quality performance that conforms to an industry “average” of acceptable product and service standards. The 3-Star Airline rating signifies a satisfactory standard of core Product for most travel categories (ie. cabin of travel), but it also reflects some inconsistency amongst either standards of front-line Staff Service or Product delivery for the Cabin Service and their home-base Airport environments.

Euhm ... 5/10 is 5/10 ... Those are the passengers thoughts.
Out of 25 stars to be earned SN has 1 more on food and beverage (and that doesnt even apply to short haul) so yeah .... You like to use airlinequality.com? There you have it

Airlinequality gives the scores out of 10 AND the skytrax star. You don't need the mention partly information only because that is more convenient for you!

[airazurxtror]

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/Articles/ ... mazon.html

Excerpts :

Ryanair aims to become the “Amazon for travel” in Europe and almost double annual profits to €2 billion over the next six to eight years, according to chief executive Michael O’Leary.
The budget carrier plans to expand its website into travel and leisure services, such as hotels and concerts.
Ancillaries were likely to stay about 20% to 25% of total revenue, he said, but make a bigger contribution towards profitability in the future, he said.

The airline wants to increase the number of passengers it carries from about 100 million this year to 160 million over the next six to eight years. Over that period, it is targeting profits of €2 billion.

O’Leary ruled out the likelihood of Ryanair making any big acquisitions but said it could take minority stakes in rivals such as Lufthansa or Air France.

He expects market conditions to remain favourable for the next 12-18 months as low oil prices boost airlines’ profitability.

“The summer peak this year was extraordinary. In all the 28 years I’ve been in the business I’ve never seen such a perfect summer. Even the incompetent airlines made money,” he said.

“In the absence of any unforeseen shock, the next 12 to 18 months - with the combination of low fuel prices, low finance costs - most airlines will look like they are geniuses run by management gurus until oil prices tick back up again and [then], as Warren Buffett said, you will see who is swimming naked and who’s wearing trunks.”

[sean1982]

Airlinequality gives the scores out of 10 AND the skytrax star. You don't need the mention partly information only because that is more convenient for you!

What did I not mention? I said you had one star more on food and beverage. Out of 25! (And only cause of the long haul). The customers dont give the stars though they gave the (equal) points.

[OO-ITR]

Airlinequality gives the scores out of 10 AND the skytrax star. You don't need the mention partly information only because that is more convenient for you!

What did I not mention? I said you had one star more on food and beverage. Out of 25! (And only cause of the long haul). The customers dont give the stars though they gave the (equal) points.

You forgot to mention the skytrax star.

[sn26567]

Gentlemen (?), please, could we remain on topic and avoid making it personal. I'm tired moderating the incessant feuds between pros and cons of FR and SN. Soon I'll resort to more radical actions! I've been very patient, other moderators are less so.

[SabenaForever]

Gentlemen (?), please, could we remain on topic and avoid making it personal. I'm tired moderating the incessant feuds between pros and cons of FR and SN. Soon I'll resort to more radical actions! I've been very patient, other moderators are less so.

:clap:

[Inquirer]

And what's even more surprising is that this discussion is based on another example of the famous saying: 'there are lies, damn lies, and then there are statistics'.

Now, before Sean says I accuse him of lying once more, let me say I don't think he is; he's simply displaying a very clasical example of somebody not understanding the difference between an appreciative rating and a comparative one, 2 different things often confused.

Let me elaborate:
Skytrax asks passengers to rate their own flight: it doesn't ask them to rate the flight of another airline, nor does it ask them to compare different airlines, does it? As such, the score given by passengers is an indication of the level of satisfaction with the product offered: it's thus an appreciative element.

The evaluation of the quality of the product as well as the comparison of that product with others is however done by skytrax itself, through the (in)famous star rating; ryanair is given just 2 stars by them because they deem the airline to be of lower quality than most other airlines in Europe: that is a comparative element.

The fact customers of ryanair are almost equally satisfied with their flight than customers of a higher rated airline doesn't mean both products are equal like Sean assumes; it means both manage to satisfy the (different) expectations of their type of customers to the same level and are thus offering the same value for money: more value for more money, less value for less money.

Think about it for a minute:
if a 3 star restaurant is rated 19/20 by its visitors, and a local fish and chips shop is also rated 19/20 by its visitors, does that make the shop owner a cook as good as the star chef? of course not!
It means both places offer the same value for money and satisfy (different) needs to the same (yet different) level.

And exactly the same happens here: assuming customers to know roughly what type of airline they've booked on (a 2 star or a 3 star airline), they seem to be almost equally satisfied with the product offered to them: that's something very diffferent from saying the products themselves are of the same standing like Sean does, however. In fact one could argue it's displaying exactly the opposite even.

[sean1982]

You have an answer for everything dont you
Both FR and SN are LCC's ... they are playing in the same class (not talking about the long haul product) and the customers sometimes even refer to other LCC's when giving their rating!

just one example here:

To be honest, my experiences on Ryanair on the same route have been more pleasant. "We go the extra smile" in my case just meant: We take some extra money (for the same or lower service).

Saying that that is not comparative, is the same as saying black is not a dark colour

(I just wanna add a big fat note here. Personally I dont care, nor have I ever cared about skytrax. It's one of hundred sites where people go mostly to complain only rather than to give an objective opinion. But if other (with "passenger" up front) want to use it as a means to portray the worlds vision on Ryanair, than it's only fair to compare it with other ratings on the site)

[Passenger]

I didn't brought up the Airlinequality reviews here to focus on the difference between Ryanair and any other airline (Brussels Airlines, Biman, whatever), and I didn't brought it up to discuss about the score itself (2 stars or 5/10). No: I quoted a few passengers reviews because they confirm that many passengers are unaware about the charges and penalties.

Let me give another example: one FR passenger was surprised he had to pay 100 UKP at the check-in for his luggage. The passengers states that he thought that 20 kg was included in the fare because the online booking tool asked "do you want to add extra luggage?" - and not "add luggage?". If this person flew 20 times with British Airways or a holiday charter before, he indeed assumed that luggage is included with the flight: "...I was so angry as there is nothing that states when you book your holiday that you have to "check in" your luggage too? The only question you are asked is if you want to check in "extra luggage" - well to me we didn't have extra it was just a standard suitcase and hand luggage (which pretty much everyone takes when they go away). So when you book online that's how they catch you out as they word it wrong by saying extra luggage rather than just a standard luggage..."

Same applies for the boarding pass surcharge: passengers don't "forget it at home" and they don't "forget to print it": they simply didn't knew they had to do print it, because they never had to so with their previous flights with other airlines.

Once again: 100% of the Luchtzakkers know how it works, but many Ryanair passengers don't. And they feel ripped off.

[sean1982]

The reason why you use it passenger is not my problem. You try to use it to prove FR is a "bad" airline, while I am merely trying to prove this site is rather useless by giving comparisons

The website doesnt ask for "extra luggage". The website asks for "checked in luggage"
This exactly why I hate websites like airlinequality.com. A passenger forgets to do something, than twists the story so it looks like he didn't make the mistake (or read properly). It's not FR's fault that he flew BA 200 times and they have a different process. This is a pattern you see in many reviews with all airlines.

Pile up on the motorway and passenger misses his flight. Airline fault
Passenger arrives at the airport 1 hour before departure in peak holiday season and misses his flight. Airline fault
Passenger sees a cabin crew member doing a procedure different than on another airline: airline unsafe.

And it's this kind of populism, dear passenger, you are using to paint a picture of FR.

During the booking process you get:
Do you want to reserve a seat?
Do you want travel insurance?
Do you want to CHECK-IN a bag?
SMS?
Low Cost Parking?
Transfer?
Sport or special equipment?
Do you need assistance?

When you finish up the booking, you get the following:
Here are your boarding passes. PLEASE PRINT THEM NOW
No printer? No worries, use the app or bring THESE BOARDING PASSES IN PDF on ANY screen.

Very simple easy to follow, step-by-step instructions. If you clicked through them too quickly, you get an email as well, with THE SAME instructions that just appeared on the screen. 98% of all FR passengers know how to do this correctly.

And again, If you want to compare based on that side, fine, this "problem" is not just limited to FR

I have flown Brussels Airlines many times and generally been happy with the service. However I will never use this airline again, because quite frankly they are a rip off. I booked a complete package online, not knowing baggage was not included. Contact Brussels Airlines today to find out that I had to pay 35 euro per bag, thats a total of 140 euro, if I had booked direct with Brussels Airlines the charge would be 60 euro. How can Brussels Airlines justify more than double the price for the baggage. Brussels Airlines on baggage are a total rip off unless your book direct with them. I know they will do nothing about it as Customer Service and Brussels Airlines don't go together.

easyJet customer review


Not very impressed with extra charges on baggage (£30) especially after the flight was turned around and 4hour delay in Liverpool. A £3 voucher doesn't get you much in Liverpool airport. There was a notable absence of passengers refusing to travel afterwards.

Wizz Air customer review

After being relentlessly milked for €150 at the airport for the privilege of surly staff to print our boarding passes (in between making personal calls and delaying the process), a fairly mediocre flight was followed by a 20 minute delay in a boiling hot plane, waiting for the staff to get the plane doors open.

[airazurxtror]

I don't think that those "statistics", by Skytrax or others, are real "statistics".
They would approach the reality if all the passengers were giving their opinion, or if an independant observer made an inquest with a representative cross-section of the totality of the passengers.
When making a measure, it's very important to operate on a valid sample.

As it is, who gives his opinion ?
First, those who are furious and indignant (rightly or not), and want the whole world to know it. They naturally are prone to overstate their case.
Those who are satisfied are much less motivated to take the trouble and write it.
Who gives its opinion on English speaking sites ? Not, for instance, the French or the Belgian (these ones will rather write to Test Achats/Aankoop).

And, of course, there is always the question : are those who give their opinion genuine passengers of the concerned airline ? Nothing is easier than writing an opinion created out of nothing, in order to try and improve or destroy an airline's reputation.
There is no proof that the opinon is given by a bona fide passenger, nor that the facts related are true.
It's the big weakness of Internet.

[Passenger]

This exactly why I hate websites like airlinequality.com. A passenger forgets to do something, than twists the story so it looks like he didn't make the mistake (or read properly).

No sir. It's not "the passenger forgets". It's "the passenger doesn't know".

G Conrad (Denmark) 23rd September 2015: "...We wanted to check in at the airport, but surprisingly that is was not possible with Ryanair from 2 hours before scheduled flight. So we had to go to the check in counter and pay 50€ per person in service fee. What a scam! The business model they are running with having different rules than general airline companies are very confusing..."

Richard Lewis (Ireland) 15th September 2015: "... Not knowing that I could be charged to check in, I went to the Ryanair baggage check in desk to check in only (no baggage) and the woman there would not check me in saying that I need to do it on my smart phone for free, or on their kiosk for £45. I failed to do it online and went to the kiosks. There were 4 of them, 2 would not work, one was working badly and the 4th worked ok. It cost me the £45. If I had known about this charge and the problems involved earlier, I could have done it online at my hotel, but Ryanair would not get their silly hidden charge of £45, which made the flight dearer than Air Lingus, who did not have any charge for this the last time I flew with them..."

[sean1982]

During the booking process you get:
Do you want to reserve a seat?
Do you want travel insurance?
Do you want to CHECK-IN a bag?
SMS?
Low Cost Parking?
Transfer?
Sport or special equipment?
Do you need assistance?

When you finish up the booking, you get the following:
Here are your boarding passes. PLEASE PRINT THEM NOW
No printer? No worries, use the app or bring THESE BOARDING PASSES IN PDF on ANY screen.

Very simple easy to follow, step-by-step instructions. If you clicked through them too quickly, you get an email as well, with THE SAME instructions that just appeared on the screen. 98% of all FR passengers know how to do this correctly.

Than the passenger didnt read properly. How is that the airlines fault?
If I dont read a traffic sign and I get a fine, let's see how the judge likes my: I didnt know argument

and to settle the "hidden charges" argyment for once and for all ... They arent hidden. They are in a very clear table at the website under: find out -> fees ... CLEARLY visible

[Stij]

YAWN!

Not again THIS discussion!!! I believe everybody here knows LCC have certain policies and everybody here knows as well not every passenger knows this.

Stick to NEWS about Ryanair!

No posts deleted as no insults involved.

Stij

[Stij]

Off topic posts are being removed... Stay on topic!

[airazurxtror]

Edinburgh :
RYANAIR will join battle with three other airlines (SAS, Norwegian and EasyJet) on the Edinburgh-Copenhagen route next summer and add flights to nine of its other routes from the Scottish capital, chief executive Michael O’Leary announced today.
The more frequent services will operate between Edinburgh and Barcelona, Alicante, Brussels, Gdansk, Krakow, Stansted, Malaga, Malta and Palma.
It expects its Edinburgh passenger total to grow by 12 per cent to 2.3 million a year - nearly one quarter of those using the airport.

Read more:
https://www.aviation24.be/airlines_press_r ... -schedule/
http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/ ... z3n8q5HGxF

("Brussels" certainly means Charleroi).

[sn26567]

Widow of Ryanair founder passes away after short illness

Mrs Mairead Ryan, who was in her late 70s, passed away peacefully following a short illness. Mrs Ryan was the childhood sweetheart of Tony Ryan and the couple married in the mid-1960s, before moving to the United States.

There Tony worked as Aer Lingus station manager at New York's JFK Airport. The couple separated when their three sons were still very young, but they never divorced and they maintained an amicable relationship.

In her death notice, Mrs Ryan was described as Tony's "beloved wife".

When he died in 2007, he left her more than €20m in his will, while also leaving €6m to his most recent partner, Martine Head.

Tony Ryan's fortune was based on an aircraft-leasing business he established in a small office in the Shannon Tax Free zone in 1975 called Guinness Peat Aviation. The company grew to become the biggest airline leasing company in the world, known as GPA.

Mr Ryan then established Ryanair for his sons. The fledgling airline lost tens of millions and Mr Ryan was almost bankrupted when GPA collapsed in 1993. However, the arrival of Michael O'Leary and businessman Denis O'Brien saved the airline and renewed Ryan's fortune.

Full article with more details: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/wi ... 66482.html

[Airbus330lover]

Off topic posts are being removed... Stay on topic!