Wathelet dispersion plan for Brussels Airport

[Conti764]

Reynders (MR) is suggesting a strong Brussels front against flights from BRU and plees for moving flights to regional airports. Contrary to Wathelet he is smart enough to also name Antwerp and Ostend as alternatives, probably knowing that in fact all decentralization would go to Wallonia...

If that's going to happen, I suggest BRU management, along with the other companies start with firing Walloon and Brussels employees from the airport before Flemish employees.... Do Reynders and co have the guts to tell all those French speaking employees at BRU why exactly they have to go working 60 or 100 km away while they were having a job close to home...? Don't think so...

[b720]

The world is ploughing into the 21st century while we - in B - seem deep rooted in the 20 th.

[liege-bierset]

Reynders (MR) is suggesting a strong Brussels front against flights from BRU and plees for moving flights to regional airports. Contrary to Wathelet he is smart enough to also name Antwerp and Ostend as alternatives, probably knowing that in fact all decentralization would go to Wallonia...

If that's going to happen, I suggest BRU management, along with the other companies start with firing Walloon and Brussels employees from the airport before Flemish employees.... Do Reynders and co have the guts to tell all those French speaking employees at BRU why exactly they have to go working 60 or 100 km away while they were having a job close to home...? Don't think so...

It seems this thread has reach the bottom !
It is absolutely appealing to read such a ratting. Poltical and economic populism. Back to the future ,in 1936.

[Conti764]

@liege... Nice try. It's a disgrace how several French speaking politicians constantly attack Brussels Airport, which is one of Flanders' and thus Belgians main economic centres...

I konw I'm getting on thin ice here, this board having a bad taste for politics, but since first Wathelet, followed by Reynders turn this issue into a political one, you cannot discuss this item without politics.

It's obvious that certain people always make this ridiculous referral to the 30s when confronted with the truth, which means in this matter that no matter how they try to demonise the Flemish nationalists, it are actually French speaking politicians who are the real nationalists in every single issue. The discussions about the flight dispersal plan is the best proof. It's obvious that since the very start of the discussions, Wathelet and co had only one thing in mind: lurring airlines to CRL or LGG, even at the cost of BRU...

And since all Walloon politicians have a hidden agenda in this issue, it's Flanders' obligation to save as many jobs as possible.

[Stij]

@ Conti 764 and Liège-Bierset:

Warning! Please keep it cool!!!

Correct: the forum doesn't like the taste of politics, so please stay away from it.
Referrals to the 30's are also politics and are especially to be avoided.

This forum is pro Belgian aviation, not pro-Flemish / pro-Walloon.

Since a long time I wanted to write this:

Consider Belgian aviation as a cake and the airliners / airports as hungry people around it.
There are 2 strategies to eat enough cake:
Put all your energy in the fight for a bigger slice of the cake...
or...
Fight together to make the cake bigger so everyone has enough...

For those without imagination:
Try to lure airliners / pax away from airports in other countries instead of from each other.

Cheers,

Stij

[Acid-drop]

Don't forget those airlines could go outside belgium. It did happen already with DHL.
Some flemish extremists seems to prefer the option "i eat the cake alone or i destroy the cake" like a spoiled 3 years old kid.
In wallonia nobody seem to be surprised that many flemish and dutch are working in LGG. (But there is no well organized extremist party)
Obviously: the airport is just a transport facility, like a highway, companies are from everywhere.

[teach]

Don't forget those airlines could go outside belgium. It did happen already with DHL.
Some flemish extremists seems to prefer the option "i eat the cake alone or i destroy the cake" like a spoiled 3 years old kid.
In wallonia nobody seem to be surprised that many flemish and dutch are working in LGG. (But there is no well organized extremist party)
Obviously: the airport is just a transport facility, like a highway, companies are from everywhere.

Wow.

Talk about 'avoiding politics'. Aren't you a moderator? Didn't your fellow mod just 20 minutes before your post warn about staying away from politics and Flanders vs Wallonia BS? So exactly what gave you the idea that the perfect follow-up to that would be a post in which you poured MORE oil onto the fire by ... inserting yet more Flanders vs Wallonia BS into the discussion?

[Acid-drop]

I agree that this discussion isn't a aviation discussion, it's political from the start.
I won't close it because i don't mind listening all opinions. If other moderators have enough, I believe we should close it, moderation isn't an option here.

and you are right, i like adding oil on the fire and show how the situation is ridiculous. Here is one more for our extremists friend:
Since anybody with a good diploma can find a job anyway, why do you bother ? Why fighing for zaventem ? They'll find a job anyway. Right ?

[Passenger]

Don't forget those airlines could go outside belgium. It did happen already with DHL.
Some flemish extremists seems to prefer the option "i eat the cake alone or i destroy the cake" like a spoiled 3 years old kid.
In wallonia nobody seem to be surprised that many flemish and dutch are working in LGG. (But there is no well organized extremist party)
Obviously: the airport is just a transport facility, like a highway, companies are from everywhere.

Wow.

Talk about 'avoiding politics'. Aren't you a moderator? Didn't your fellow mod just 20 minutes before your post warn about staying away from politics and Flanders vs Wallonia BS? So exactly what gave you the idea that the perfect follow-up to that would be a post in which you poured MORE oil onto the fire by ... inserting yet more Flanders vs Wallonia BS into the discussion?

Indeed. I was thinking the same: it's quite strange to read "some Flemish extremists..." and "in Wallonia... there is no well organized extremist party..." in the same phrase ànd coming from a moderator.

Facts are, Acid-drop:

1. there is no Flemish political party (*) using Brussels Airport as main topic in its election campaign.

2. Flanders regard Brussels Airport is a business tool to the benefit of the whole country. Flemish parties ànd Flemish people (i.e. all Flemish media) regard "Zaventem" as "Brussels Airport" and as Belgium's largest airport and not as Flanders' largest airport! If Flemish people and/or politicians speak about Flemish airports, they mean Antwerp, Ostend, Wevelgem/Kortrijk. Not Brussels Airport.

3. there is common sense in Flanders that Wathelet has amended the dispersion plan in bad faith: for own electoral reasons. Ethics seems to be different in north and south: in the north, it's seen as shocking and not done that a federal secretary of State uses his power to disadvantage a federal airport in favour of his own local airport.

4. Your so called "Flemish extremists" only reacted to an ultra extremist act: the statement by the federal secretary of State that cargo and charters should move to LGG and CRL.

(*) I exclude the eco-green environment extremists Groen who hate airports because aircraft fly on fuel.

[Passenger]

Here is one more for our extremists friend: Since anybody with a good diploma can find a job anyway, why do you bother ? Why fighing for zaventem ? They'll find a job anyway. Right ?

What a poor reaction for a moderator.

[Acid-drop]

I'm not "a moderator". I'm not more catholic than the pope. I'm a person with my (very biased) personal opinion. Hence my signature.
Your facts are ... well... facts... indeed. When I started the talk about flemish extremists, it was just to answer to some extremists talk higher up... Now it doesn't mean I agree with the Wathelet strategy. I'm in strong favour of a national voting system so people from both sides have to deal with the impact on the other half. It will kill extremists of both sides.

[teach]

I'm not "a moderator".

So why is your name in green?

[b720]

Let us remain objective. The whole issue is noise nuisance to those living on the approach of runways in use.
BRU is not a mega intercontinental hub, absolute majority of the flights are intra-EUR. The night curfew does not affect operations at BRU. Apart from the odd cargo flights, and a few charters, there is no activity at BRU at night, and there is no need for that activity to commence. People who choose to live around an airport must accept an acceptable level of noise pollution, the way many of us accept the noise of the bus, or tram that stop in front of our door. We can't just make use of the convenience of having a bus stop in front of our front door and complain about the noise.. one makes up for the other. To return to the BRU issue, I think that aircraft are generating less and less noise. The hinder is almost negligible in winter. Maybe it is cheaper for all involved to start a fund that subsidizes the installment of high level sound proof windows for those involved? Is such a thing in place already? Apart from that, the neighbors of the airport have no choice. They can always move.

[Squelsh]

When I started the talk about flemish extremists, it was just to answer to some extremists talk higher up...

Ah, good ol' turddrop is calling anyone disagreeing with the Walloon politicians 'extremists' again. What happened to Xenophobic? People venting these extreme words about posters, when logged on under a green moderator name are a true sh!t-stain on fora. Check extremist in a dictionary, nothing like that was said.. I only read an 'If this happens.. then fire these people'.. Extremist would be 'fire all those french-speaking people" sec.

The way it is going now, ANYONE contesting this plan is anti-Wallonia, and extremist.
Yes, even all the flemish people who want and who will lose their job to this fruitcake-plan, can now work in LGG or CRL... perfect solution, where is the problem? PLAYING INNOCENT... as always.. Oh please - so transparent

Yes, DHL left, that cake was destroyed by some green french-speaking gap who wanted to promote LGG, had nothing to do with 'extremists' behaving like a three-yr old.. Or how to twist things once again.. All was Ok at zaventem for DECADES, untill this cnt started about curfews, and EVER SINCE, we're in this shit, and EVER SINCE, a tumbling stone as been noted from full cargo's going to LGG. That's the result, don't be surprised if some flemmish people get a deja-vu feeling whenever a walloon minister starts unilaterelly fidgetting the routes/curfews at BRU.. It always ends up in shit and companies leaving... Extremists;, hah zielig manneke, job protection, yes.

[Acid-drop]

While extremist are trying to destroy the country, Kris Peeters is taking another route... check his latest press release.

when logged on under a green moderator name are a true sh!t-stain on fora.

now it is enough. I'm a moderator for technical reasons, not for moderating anyone's opinion (which I find very wrong). But if you attack me personally i'll ask a moderator to moderate your crap.

[BRU]

Yes, DHL left, that cake was destroyed by some green french-speaking gap who wanted to promote LGG, had nothing to do with 'extremists' behaving like a three-yr old.. Or how to twist things once again.. All was Ok at zaventem for DECADES, untill this cnt started about curfews, and EVER SINCE, we're in this shit, and EVER SINCE, a tumbling stone as been noted from full cargo's going to LGG.

Should be noted, and it only makes it worse, that most full cargo flights that stopped operating at BRU or reduced frequencies were in no way to the benefit of LGG. Only ET left to LGG, mainly due to traffic rights reasons. ALL others ended up in airports in other countries: AMS, FRA, MST, LUX, ...

The governement creates a war between LGG and BRU, result is we all loose and that the cake gets smaller... Only to make competitors smile and wonder, again and again, why we in Belgium think the world exists of a Flemish and a Walloon part and nothing else... What a shame and so many lost opportunities...

It feels like the Red Devils making at least 3 own goals every game in Brasil and wondering why we didn't became world champion...

[HQ_BRU_Lover]

This is going nowhere, wouldn't it be better to close this topic? I mean: how can you discuss this topic about a political subject when you can't discuss politics? It's like discussing the Tour de France without naming any cyclist...

Luchtzak at its best, "pure propaganda"

[Passenger]

While extremist are trying to destroy the country, Kris Peeters is taking another route... check his latest press release.

Acid-drop, in reply to your own crap:

1. there is only one political party that wants to "destroy the country": Vlaams Belang. Based upon the latest polls, they will end up with some 6 tot 8% of the Flemish votes, meaning 4 tot 6% in the federal parliament.

2. the other "extremists" you are referring to (see also your remark about the job application story, today in Het Laatste Nieuws) is probably the N-VA. Their aim is confederalism. Thus not the destriction of Belgium, but the implementation of article 35 of the Belgian constitution.

3. Ceci n'est pas une pipe. Your name is put here in green bold, and if one clicks on it, it shows "Global moderator". If you keep on denying that you are a moderator, you are going to surpass Iraq's Comical Ali "there are no American troops in Bagdad" on CNN. US tanks on the background.

4. Off course this topic is a political one. No problem. But you are making party-politics of it - whilst all others here have tried to avoid that till now.

[Squelsh]

Should be noted, and it only makes it worse, that most full cargo flights that stopped operating at BRU or reduced frequencies were in no way to the benefit of LGG. Only ET left to LGG, mainly due to traffic rights reasons. ALL others ended up in airports in other countries: AMS, FRA, MST, LUX, ...

K4

edit: + icelandic

plus few others can't get from the top off my head now

[Acid-drop]

Should be noted, and it only makes it worse, that most full cargo flights that stopped operating at BRU or reduced frequencies were in no way to the benefit of LGG. Only ET left to LGG, mainly due to traffic rights reasons. ALL others ended up in airports in other countries: AMS, FRA, MST, LUX, ...

The governement creates a war between LGG and BRU, result is we all loose and that the cake gets smaller... Only to make competitors smile and wonder, again and again, why we in Belgium think the world exists of a Flemish and a Walloon part and nothing else... What a shame and so many lost opportunities...

It feels like the Red Devils making at least 3 own goals every game in Brasil and wondering why we didn't became world champion...

Good summary.