Ryanair passengers held hostage

[Filip146200]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASDuLY3F ... pp=desktop

[Stij]

How can you screw up this much?
Were they really planning to keep the pax inside until 6:00am?

Cheers,

Stij

[cathay belgium]

A real disgrace !
Guess at some other airports the result would have been , much, worse !
CXB

[Inquirer]

That's quite disturbing to watch indeed.

if I understood the situation well, the plane got delayed past the night curfew of the airport and so 'the plan' was to simply keep everybody onboard till reopening of the airport early next morning?

What I don't understand is why nobody of the airline or the crew seems to be able to come up with a new plan when it becomes obvious they can't set through with it, as if they are somehow scared to deviate from whatever company procedures they may -or may not- have, as that may cause additional costs.

Who's in charge of that plane? Where's the captain for instance?
I see that cockpit door remaining closed all the time and cabin crew struggling to calm passengers down? Surely he's entitled to call for a bus to deboard those passengers willing to get off, or to ask for a catering uplift for those who want to stay? Or is he really just a busdriver in the eyes of his management then?

I've been stuck on planes due to bad weather in the past, but I've never been held hostage by an airline in this way and in any case, free drinks and some food, a working airconditioning and the right to get off after a reasonable delay are elementary for any airline, IMHO.

[airazurxtror]

The passengers of the flight to Porto found themselves unable to leave for three hours, and the plane didn't even depart at the end of it.
The short flight to Portugal was supposed to leave around 8pm, but 7am the next day travellers were still waiting.
Ryanair sincerely apologised to passengers affected by the delays, which were caused by adverse weather and and fuelling at the airport, and said that contrary to the video's claims of no food and drink passengers were provided with refreshment vouchers.

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/new ... 41389.html

At STN, after security, Starbucks and Caffe Italia are open 24/24 - Bridge, Espresso Lounge, F&B's Deli, Prêt a manger, ... close late in the evening and open at 4 am :
http://www.stanstedairport.com/shopping ... urants-a-z

[cathay belgium]

passengers were provided with refreshment vouchers.

WAW when everything was closed to buy !
It was even mentioned in the video that there was no availability for food and drinks !



Great communication !

CXB

[airazurxtror]

Lex, I can understand that the guy was furious and prone to do some RYR bashing, but as I have just pointed out, amongst others Starbucks (a favorite of yours, I remember), is open 24/24 at Stansted airside ...
(By the way, have a nice flight in the DC 10 !)

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

I'm really not a ryanair basher but this was truely a disgrace, even if vouchers where given and starbucks was open, btw would have preferred Costa in STN
But who is the worse to blame...
I guess the crew and then the FR management...
You don't leave pax in a cabin for that long, no communication from the pilot is not worth giving him a flying licence..
Pilots are in charge of pax and plane, a closed door is ....
I really feel sorry for that crew who really didn't know how to react in this way and how do deal with this..
Maybe sean or so can give us a clear view on the FR policy in such cases..
If it was easy,brussels,ryanair,... this may not have happened everywhere,anythime...

CXB

[fcw]

If anybody else than the police, would have opened the door to the terminal they would be in prison by now and they would loose their airside access permit for life.

[crew1990]

who? The crew?

[RoMax]

If anybody else than the police, would have opened the door to the terminal they would be in prison by now and they would loose their airside access permit for life.

Probably, but couldn't they arrange something when they knew the airport terminal would close down (and before it was actually closed)...after all they (the crew) must have known they wouldn't go anywhere anymore during that night.

But how does that actually work overthere...STN has 24h operations, but they do have major night quota restrictions between 23:30 and 06:00 (so I assume mostly freigt operations during the night with very few pax flights around mid night like in BRU?), but why do they lock down the terminal (at least from airside) even with passengers still out there in an aircraft which is not getting anywhere (or did they do it because the FR crew was saying to the airport they would keep their pax in the aircraft until the morning?)? And why are certain things like Starbucks etc open after security for 24 hours a day when there are no operations? Of course passengers start to flow in during the late night already for the early morning flights, but that's not between let's say 24:00 (or just after last flight leaves) until 04:00.

[sean1982]

Yes, the crew, that's how it goes in the UK.

Some facts: crew tried to call airport personel plenty of times to no avail. What else could they have done? Let the pax on the ramp in front of closed doors? If you watch carefully you hear the police officer (who were called by the crew btw):"we have given the airport duty manager an ultimatum to answer our calls" which clearly indicates the crew certainly couldn't have done more.

They were led to believe that they would be able to take off before curfew. When that didn't work, airport staff f*cked off home and left them helpless and clueless. Or do you think they are In that situation for their pleasure?

Furthermore, All passengers were compensated according to EU rules.

I fail to see how this is the airlines fault, but off course it's easy to jump to conclusions based on a YouTube video without waiting for facts first.

[RoMax]

For me it is hard to believe the airport staff simply close down the terminal when they know there are still pax on board an aircraft which can not take off anymore. I assume the crew didn't wait until the airport was actually closed before asking for their pax to get out?

That the airport staff doesn't want to re-open the terminal to let the pax in is something I can not understand for sure, certainly because STN is an airport which wants to be a "high service LCC airport". But neither do I understand how the crew handled the situation. I'm quite sure they must have known some time before closure they wouldn't take off and could still deboard the aircraft before the closure of the terminal, I can not believe the handler refused this before the closure of the airport.

But why doens't the crew sell catering? It must have been on board, no? Pax were even telling they have money to pay and want something to eat or to drink even if they have to pay for it. Even if there is some strang policy that crew cannot sell catering in such an event...I still don't understand it, rather having a full 738 of angry pax for many hours and you can be sure these pax will never fly FR again, neither their close relatives and many people watching this video.

[sean1982]

For me it is hard to believe the airport staff simply close down the terminal when they know there are still pax on board an aircraft which can not take off anymore. I assume the crew didn't wait until the airport was actually closed before asking for their pax to get out?

That the airport staff doesn't want to re-open the terminal to let the pax in is something I can not understand for sure, certainly because STN is an airport which wants to be a "high service LCC airport". But neither do I understand how the crew handled the situation. I'm quite sure they must have known some time before closure they wouldn't take off and could still deboard the aircraft before the closure of the terminal, I can not believe the handler refused this before the closure of the airport.

Well, don't be "sure", that's how it went down, they were promised a fuelling truck which in the end never turned up ... the airport duty manager even refused to listen to the police who ultimately had to force a terminal door

But why doens't the crew sell catering? It must have been on board, no? Pax were even telling they have money to pay and want something to eat or to drink even if they have to pay for it. Even if there is some strang policy that crew cannot sell catering in such an event...I still don't understand it, rather having a full 738 of angry pax for many hours and you can be sure these pax will never fly FR again, neither their close relatives and many people watching this video.

This is again not an FR procedure. There are laws that prohibit the opening of trollies on the ground when they contain alcohol or perfumes. All FR trollies contain either or both.

[Squelsh]

Weird to see another YT vid about an FR flight ending up with the police coming to the rescue of the passengers, while the crew just stands there and doesn't grow a pair; just break the seal and give drinks and food.. Human beings for hours with so many in a metal frame in the middle of the night..

I bet if you gave them the free drinks you'd get a report (even if you want to pay for it out of your own pocket), that's why IMHO -just like with the previous incident on that hot hot summer day in Holland- no more extra help than allowed by strict policy is offered and the crew hides in the galley. IMHO, if allowed. PS: nothing personal

[RoMax]

Well, don't be "sure", that's how it went down, they were promised a fuelling truck which in the end never turned up ... the airport duty manager even refused to listen to the police who ultimately had to force a terminal door

From the moment the truck still did not arrive and you know that even if it still does, you will still not make it before the night curfew, you get your pax out of the aircraft. That must have been before the terminal closure otherwise you know there will never come a fuel truck.

This is again not an FR procedure. There are laws that prohibit the opening of trollies on the ground when they contain alcohol or perfumes. All FR trollies contain either or both.

Interesting, didn't know that. And how bad are the consequences if this rules are not followed? Bad enough to compensate for hours of angry passengers in the middle of the night and thousands of potential customers that will think twice before chosing FR?

To make it clear, I'm just asking questions because there are many things I really do not understand why there were not alternatives. Certainly the airport staff, but I do question certain actions of the FR crew as well...

[theeuropean]

Airlines cannot sell food/give food when on the ground. This is for inventory and tax reasons. Since food is sold in the air it is exempt from VAT. Most of the time if food is brought in a plane in this type of circumstance the airline will buy the bottles of water from a store that is inside a terminal.

The crew could have been a bit more communicative I think. But in this video clip we only see a fraction of the whole duration so god knows if they came out more regularly - which if that happened the author of the clip edited that out, or they could have as shown not been very engaged.

The airport duty manager, or whoever was in charge of the airport operations could have opened it I think if they had just asked for permission. Airports do close down and its not just LCC airports that do. However, the starbucks can be open all night as people do sleep in the terminal buildings. A friend of mine did it in Charleroi Airport when she flew from Poland to Casablanca or Rabat and it was a evening flight coming in and a super early one the next day, and when she was there it was full of people doing the same sort of "connection." If it happens in CRL it definitely happens at Stansted.

At the end of the day I think its responsibility on behalf of Airline, Airport, Swissport and not passengers and it most certainly should not have come to the point where they have to call the police to come and get them out.

[AirOpinion]

This is just poor flight operations controlling...

What concerns the passenger rights:

Article 9 Right to care

1. Where reference is made to this Article, passengers shall be offered free of charge:
(a) meals and refreshments in a reasonable relation to the waiting time;
(b) hotel accommodation in cases
- where a stay of one or more nights becomes necessary, or
- where a stay additional to that intended by the passenger becomes necessary;
(c) transport between the airport and place of accommodation (hotel or other).
2. In addition, passengers shall be offered free of charge two telephone calls, telex or fax messages, or e-mails.
3. In applying this Article, the operating air carrier shall pay particular attention to the needs of persons with reduced mobility and any persons accompanying them, as well as to the needs of unaccompanied children.

Seems rather clear to me that not all of the above points have been fullfilled. Let's not forget that the term 'passenger rights' does not only mean financial compensation...

[Flanker2]

First of all, the video illustrates the society of self-involved, self-pitied complainers that we have become.
Some females trying to escalate the males, knowing that they are 189 against 4 crews + 2 pilots.
Some using their kids or other people's kids as a bargaining tool to get the crews and police to do something that might get them fired, just to save themselves a few hours of "freedom" that they'll probably just spend doing nothing important.

A few minutes, a few hours, what does it really matter? It's not like the crew are holding macheti's and raping the women... it's not like they are on the sinking Titanic with immediate threat to their life. In fact, people don't need to eat and drink constantly, otherwise how could one sleep at night? and it was night, right?
They had plenty of time to buy drinks and sandwiches while the airport was open!

My remarks:
1. Congratulations to the crews for keeping their nerves. They weren't there for their pleasure, that is certain.

2. Imagine yourself as cabin crew at the end of the day, when the last of the catering is on board, armed with 30 cans of 20cl juice and 3 cl bottles of alcohol... if you give one can to a passenger, the other 188 pax will want their share... so the best you can do is to keep it in order to provide it only to people starting to show signs of dehydration and the children. Giving alcohol is out of the question, it will only make matters worse.

3. They have some nerves at STN, to treat FR and all those passengers like that.

4. Bravo to the police for breaking the pax into the terminal, they can get in trouble for that... pax also seemed to ignore the no-smoking policies, and were trying to smoke on an apron where the APU was running.
But pax don't understand all the bureaucracy that comes with an airline operation, and their little nicotine addiction and self-pity is so much important to them.

5. When you travel aboard an aircraft as paying passenger, you forfeit some rights. When you are on an aircraft, one of those forfeited rights is the right to step out of an aircraft at any time you wish. You can't step out of an aircraft unless the crew deems it safe. It's not safe to have 189 pax walking on the apron, whether the airport is open or closed for service, and you can't control 189 pax if you're only 4 crews. If they find the terminal closed, some pax might start running towards fences, trying to jump over them...

6. As for the pilots hiding away from sight with cockpit doors closed... well in such situations it doesn't take much to go from irritated pax to hijack status... all it takes is for a pax to enter the cockpit and start threatening the pilots and you have a hijack... it's a very thin line there.
Oh yeah the pilots were there, an aircraft with an APU running must be under direct supervision of flight or maintenance crew who know how to cut off the fuel flow if there's a APU fire. And the APU was running.

If you're naive enough to think that our egoist selves of this working generation will respect the personality of the captain, you are mistaken... I've seen plenty of pax insulting captains who apologetically stood by the cockpit door in a sign of respect towards their delayed pax... with FR but also in BRU, with SN.

It doesn't matter if it's FR or some other airline.
I'm disgusted that none of the (male) pax came in support of the crew who were overwhelmed and instead filmed it to show how "evil" they are to keep them "hostage"...

If you dare to point your finger at the FR crew in this scenario, having watched the clip, I'm sorry but you're an egoist whiner and a shame for humanity, as are the many complainers seen in this video.

Also the crew will be more cooperative, thankful and distribute drinks to those in need if the group shows more maturity and doesn't behave like children. If you see that a group behaves like children like in this video, the last thing you want to do is to give in to any of their demands, as it will escalate into something ugly.

[FlightMate]

Waiting for more details, but it seems the blame should be on the airport authorities.
Too bad FR hasn't got much choice. I imagine they would easily pull the plug or ask for compensations if it was some small regional airport in Spain or in France.