A first big problem (and delay) for the JAF 787 OO-JDL ?

[sn26567]

OO-JDL B787-8 JAF502 from Cancun, due this morning at 04:40 is delayed until tomorrow. Any idea why?

[Duke]

OO-JDL B787-8 JAF502 from Cancun, due this morning at 04:40 is delayed until tomorrow. Any idea why?

No info yet?
In the good old days of "TUC" there would be a whole new topic about this delay...
Regards,

Duke

[Passenger]

OO-JDL B787-8 JAF502 from Cancun, due this morning at 04:40 is delayed until tomorrow. Any idea why?

No info yet?
In the good old days of "TUC" there would be a whole new topic about this delay...
Regards,

Duke

It's an antenna problem - arrival in Brussels is now foreseen for Monday morning says Jetairfly.

source: Flemish state television VRT:
http://www.deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/b ... /1.1857795

[Inquirer]

I don't know of course, but Cancun, Mexico is pretty close to the USA, so how long does it take to get an antenna out there from the Boeing factory itself? Besides, the 787 isn't such a rare sight in Mexico either: Aeromexico itself is flying them, for instance!

[Duke]

It's an antenna problem - arrival in Brussels is now foreseen for Monday morning says Jetairfly.

source: Flemish state television VRT:
http://www.deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/b ... /1.1857795

This was about to happen, and will happen again.
Using only one aircraft for such a tight schedule, without back-up will again lead to cancellations, and frustrations to passengers.
Especially with a type that is famous for having "child diseases".
I'm still surprised by the difference in the way this delay is presented : here in a topic about abnormalities in Brussels.
When TUC had the same (minor) problems, there were separate topic for it, with whole articles about the terrible state of the plane, and long stories about people being late and missing days at work, etc...
Anyway, I hope the problem with the antenna will be solved soon. And there are worse places than Cancun to get stuck for two days.
Regards,

Duke

[Duke]

Several media report OO-JDL is stuck in Cancun since last Friday with an antenna problem.
Return flight should be tonight, arrival tomorrow morning, so a delay of two days for 250 passengers.
Why does it take two days to find a replacement part?
News about this is spread and hidden in different topics, maybe we should continue news about this in this topic?
Regards,

Duke

[sn26567]

OO-JDL B787-8 JAF502 from Cancun, due this morning at 04:40 is delayed until tomorrow. Any idea why?

No info yet?
In the good old days of "TUC" there would be a whole new topic about this delay...
Regards,

Duke

It's an antenna problem - arrival in Brussels is now foreseen for Monday morning says Jetairfly.

And therefore JAF703 to Punta Cana and San Domingo this morning was operated by the 767 OO-JAP and JAF727 to Mombasa and Zanzibar tonight with an A330-200 (Which one? Does anybody know?).

And hopefully JAF107 tomorrow to Varadero and Cancun will see the resumption of the normal 788 schedule.

[Passenger]

New arrival time on BrusselsAirport.be is now set for 05h15, Monday morning.

[sdbelgium]

JAF727 to Mombasa and Zanzibar tonight with an A330-200 (Which one? Does anybody know?)

My bet is on one of those HiFly aircraft now in BRU.

[Desert Rat]

I wonder wich antenna could cause such a disaster...

WXR?
VHF?
HF?
TCAS?
RA?
LOC?
GS?
MMR/GPS?

A/C being AOG it should be something serious...the only serious one are TCAS and WXR...

[airazurxtror]

On the RTL news today was reminded the fact that each passenger has a right to a 600 euros indemnity.

[Malaysia]

JAF727 to Mombasa and Zanzibar tonight with an A330-200 (Which one? Does anybody know?)

My bet is on one of those HiFly aircraft now in BRU.

And you are right! CS-TQP A330-200

[epsilon]

I wonder wich antenna could cause such a disaster...

WXR?
VHF?
HF?
TCAS?
RA?
LOC?
GS?
MMR/GPS?

A/C being AOG it should be something serious...the only serious one are TCAS and WXR...

My bet is on the transponder.
http://avherald.com/h?article=46ecf9c3&opt=0
http://avherald.com/h?article=469305b9&opt=0
http://avherald.com/h?article=4694a17f&opt=0

[Passenger]

On the RTL news today was reminded the fact that each passenger has a right to a 600 euros indemnity.

That's probably what Test Achats / Test-Aankoop, private incasso firms (revendication bureaus) and some politicians have told them. However, during the last years, the National Enforcement Bodies who have to decide on these indemnities seems to agree that safety is at risk when safety issues are penalized. Common sense indeed. Just like Civil Aviation Authorities investigating a crash or accident do not condemn or punish, but only give recommendations or directives. Why? Because only then airlines and airline staff will fully collaborate with the investigation, and this will most likely result in avoiding another possible crash or incident with the same kind of aircraft for the same reason.

There are reports that all safety related delays will soon be accepted as extraordinary circumstances, if the failure is prohibiting the airline to operate under the minimum equipment list (and on condition that the fault is not discovered during overnight maintenance).

[Passenger]

New arrival time on BrusselsAirport.be is now set for 05h15, Monday morning.

Meanwhile, it became 07h15.

[airazurxtror]

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/tr ... ights/air/

Long delays - if your flight is delayed by 5 hours or more, you are also entitled to a refund (But if you accept a refund, the airline does not have to provide any further onward travel or assistance).

Your airline must inform you about your rights and the reason for being denied boarding, or any cancellations or long delays (over 2 hours, although this may be up to 4 hours for flights in excess of 3500 Km).

Food and board

You may also be entitled to refreshments, meals, communications (such as a free phone call), and, if necessary, overnight stay, depending on the flight distance and length of delay.

Financial compensation

In addition, if you are denied boarding, your flight is cancelled or arrives more than 3 hours late on arrival at the final destination stated on your ticket, you may be entitled to compensation of €250 - 600, depending on the distance of the flight:

Within the EU
1,500 km or less - €250
over 1,500 km - €400

Between EU airport and non-EU airport
1,500 km or less - €250
1,500 - 3,500 km - €400
over 3,500 km - €600

[Passenger]

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/tr ... ights/air/

Long delays - if your flight is delayed by 5 hours or more, you are also entitled to a refund (But if you accept a refund, the airline does not have to provide any further onward travel or assistance).

Your airline must inform you about your rights and the reason for being denied boarding, or any cancellations or long delays (over 2 hours, although this may be up to 4 hours for flights in excess of 3500 Km).

Food and board

You may also be entitled to refreshments, meals, communications (such as a free phone call), and, if necessary, overnight stay, depending on the flight distance and length of delay.

Financial compensation

In addition, if you are denied boarding, your flight is cancelled or arrives more than 3 hours late on arrival at the final destination stated on your ticket, you may be entitled to compensation of €250 - 600, depending on the distance of the flight:

Within the EU
1,500 km or less - €250
over 1,500 km - €400

Between EU airport and non-EU airport
1,500 km or less - €250
1,500 - 3,500 km - €400
over 3,500 km - €600

This has to be added:

"...As under the Montreal Convention, obligations on operating air carriers should be limited or excluded in cases where an event has been caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken. Such circumstances may, in particular, occur in cases of political instability, meteorological conditions incompatible with the operation of the flight concerned, security risks, unexpected flight safety shortcomings and strikes that affect the operation of an operating air carrier..."

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/Lex ... 61:EN:HTML

[sn26567]

By personal experience (not later than last December), I know that Jetairfly takes very good care of delayed passengers: meals and accommodation, transportation to (excellent) hotels. Since, in my case, the delay was due to meteorological circumstances, I did not ask for compensation, although I arrived at my final destination with a delay of 24 hours.

[Passenger]

By personal experience (not later than last December), I know that Jetairfly takes very good care of delayed passengers: meals and accommodation, transportation to (excellent) hotels. Since, in my case, the delay was due to meteorological circumstances, I did not ask for compensation, although I arrived at my final destination with a delay of 24 hours.

Good to hear, and that's the way EU Rule 261/2004 should be seen: if there is a delay caused by extraordinary circumstances, it depends on the nature of those circumstances to define the service and support the airline must give. For this incident, press reports suggest that Jetairfly did what common sense suggested: all pax on JAF-502 have been offered a 5-star hotel in Cancun, plus free meals & drinks, and probably a phone call to Belgium for those without smartphone or laptop. But Jetairfly is allowed to waive the indemnity of 600 Euro as per 261/2004 because the antenna failure is not caused by them and could not have been detected during line maintenance.

Unfortunately, not all airlines apply common sense when extraordinary circumstances apply - example when the destination airport is closed because of fog, a few airlines drop off passengers in strange airports without giving them further assistance. It's these few airlines that cause European politicians to ask for a review of 261/2004.

[airazurxtror]

Good to hear, and that's the way EU Rule 261/2004 should be seen: if there is a delay caused by extraordinary circumstances, it depends on the nature of those circumstances to define the service and support the airline must give. For this incident, press reports suggest that Jetairfly did what common sense suggested: all pax on JAF-502 have been offered a 5-star hotel in Cancun, plus free meals & drinks, and probably a phone call to Belgium for those without smartphone or laptop. But Jetairfly is allowed to waive the indemnity of 600 Euro as per 261/2004 because the antenna failure is not caused by them and could not have been detected during line maintenance.

If you want to believe the airlines, everything is "extraordinary circumstance".
Anyway, why do you so much object to those passengers being indemnised for the inconvenience ? What is wrong with that ? Are you so big a Jetairfly shareholder ?