Ryanair at Brussels Airport

[sean1982]

Exactly, thank you teddybAIR

[Poeli]

Stij,
I have flown 4 FR flights just yesterday, and, believe me, the FR passengers behave like any other passengers at any airport. There are some who know their way about, and some first-timers, like everywhere. And there was no rush "everybody for himself" to get a seat.
If you want to see people that behave like cattle, go and try to get on a bus, tram, metro or a shuttle train at the rush hours ...
Cheers,
Michel

Hi Michel,

Good for you! And very wise to travel on late autumn midweek flights. Try the full weekend flights in July or August to the tourist traps your wife likes to go to... we'll talk again...

However, one light at the end of the tunnel: I'm sure it'll improve when assigned seating will be implemented.

Cheers,

Stij

You get what you pay for. If you want numbered seats you could have ordered them through the website (and pay for them). I find it very very rude of you to generalise the people flying with Ryanair. They're no different than other airline customers, they just watch their money. In my expierence (10+ FR flights), people are no different than on other airlines.

That's like saying that ALL JAF customers are brainless people who go on a once in a year trip to lay at the beach for 2 weeks. There are extremes everywhere. But stating that all customers are rude and behave like cattle is as low as the examples you mentioned.

Back on topic. Is it me or are the flights not yet bookable? I really fear for the people working at Brussels Airlines. This might hurt them big time.

[teddybAIR]

Looking at the destinations they want to offer, I think they would be more of a competition for the holiday charter airlines flying from BRU. But looking at my own behavior, I would not be willing to fly Ryanair for half the price from BRU if that means that the departure slot would be 2-3 hours later. I think that the morning capacity of BRU is already congested, so Ryanair would need to buy sub-optimal slots. Now, there's always gonna be a segment that is willing to sacrifice a few hours of holidays for 100€ or so, but I know I'm not.

[Poeli]

Depends on who their target is i think. They state business routes, but i think business people only care about the timing of the routes. Younger people going on holiday don't care about the flying times (I'm one of them-slept in airports before), but that would mean less passengers for Charleroi if they would fly from BRU.

[b720]

Their FCO flight schedule is actually more convenient than that of SN!

[CTBke]

I think on the airport side it's not that bad that they attract more routes and new airliners... because Brussels at this moment is busy in the morning with all the LH routes and during the day there are some very very silent moments... for Aviapartner/Swissport this is good ... about the competion side this might be not that good for other airliners but maybe it's time for SN to really lower their prices for their B-light product... or to dismiss it and turn into Business and Economy only.

[teddybAIR]

I think on the airport side it's not that bad that they attract more routes and new airliners... because Brussels at this moment is busy in the morning with all the LH routes and during the day there are some very very silent moments... for Aviapartner/Swissport this is good ... about the competion side this might be not that good for other airliners but maybe it's time for SN to really lower their prices for their B-light product... or to dismiss it and turn into Business and Economy only.

It does put BRU in an awkward situation:
> turnaround times are a critical parameter in airline profitability as they have a direct impact on the number of sectors that can be flown and on the time that the aircraft can be employed in revenue generating activities
> I think - to be confirmed - that the turnaround time is also by far the most valued argument by airlines when faced with a decision on aircraft handling due to the direct impact on profitability
> Ryanairs succesfull business model is to a large extent based on the rapid turnaround times it can negotiate at secondary airports. Less favourable turnarount times would very fast eat into the fundamentals on which their success is based. But, legacy airlines also value those fast turnaround times
> Given the above, BRU is faced with the question on how it is going to differentiate between legacy airlines and low cost airlines in terms of handling. If you offer a low cost airline a service that provides fast turnarounds, then you better have a very strong argumentation for your existing customers as they will be demanding the very same...

Curious to see what the future will bring.

[cnc]

i doubt a rotation at MAD is done in half an hour and i doubt a rotation at BRU will take longer then at MAD

[HT-ETNW]

i doubt a rotation at MAD is done in half an hour and i doubt a rotation at BRU will take longer then at MAD

Taxi times at BCN also usually are lengthy from T2 around the end of runway 25R, past T1 to the end of runway 25L. And then you often are faced with a queue for departure.

I think that the morning capacity of BRU is already congested, so Ryanair would need to buy sub-optimal slots.

FR needs to optmize aircraft utilization when planning departure times. Therefore their morning departures will be, err. "early morning" without caring much about landside or airside congestions.
-HT

[Stij]

Good for you! And very wise to travel on late autumn midweek flights. Try the full weekend flights in July or August to the tourist traps your wife likes to go to... we'll talk again...

Isn't that regardless of the airline? I mean, every summer i get confronted with co-pax who don't seem to understand the phrase "please remain seated until the captain has turned of the seatbelt sign" and pax practically killing each other to be the first to wait for their luggage

I'm sorry... those are my experiences and since my wife got pushed out of the way, I don't travel anymore with my family (1 year old) on FR... only for business...

Cheers,

Stij

[teddybAIR]

FR needs to optmize aircraft utilization when planning departure times. Therefore their morning departures will be, err. "early morning" without caring much about landside or airside congestions.
-HT

But they need to have the required err. "slots" to do so and early morning departures at BRU are currently occupied by err. Jetairfly, Thomas Cook & Brussels Airlines. I don't think they'll just give up there slots for the sake of Ryanair.
As a matter of fact. If I was in the shoes of the market leader at BRU, I would start bidding for the early morning slots ASAP...

[Stij]

You get what you pay for. If you want numbered seats you could have ordered them through the website (and pay for them). I find it very very rude of you to generalise the people flying with Ryanair. They're no different than other airline customers, they just watch their money. In my expierence (10+ FR flights), people are no different than on other airlines.

That's like saying that ALL JAF customers are brainless people who go on a once in a year trip to lay at the beach for 2 weeks. There are extremes everywhere. But stating that all customers are rude and behave like cattle is as low as the examples you mentioned.

Back on topic. Is it me or are the flights not yet bookable? I really fear for the people working at Brussels Airlines. This might hurt them big time.

Poeli,

Please read (understand) what I write...

1. It's not about "my" given seats, it's in general: People run because they want to sit together. BTW most seats can't be booked in advance. BTW When my wife got pushed away, she had a reserved seat and priority boarding.

2. I wrote about 10% doesn't behave, not that ALL are rude and behave like cattle.

BTW I've flown 121 times on FR out of 632 in total and this is my experience. Whether you like it or not.

Cheers,

Stij

[flymd11]

BRU slots:
https://www.online-coordination.com/default.aspx

No lack of slots for morning departures.

[sn26567]

BRU slots:
https://www.online-coordination.com/default.aspx

No lack of slots for morning departures.

So, MOL was right when he said during his press conference that BRU is a "half-empty airport" where he would have no trouble finding the right slots !

[teddybAIR]

BRU slots:
https://www.online-coordination.com/default.aspx

No lack of slots for morning departures.

Indeed, based on your source, there only seems to be a window of 10 minutes in the morning, where there is a constraint on departure slots. However, the info is not entirely up to date as I think commercial flights may only be planned as of 0600LT at BRU. The website seems to suggest that BRU still has about 360 deoarture slots available before 0600LT

[Didymus]

I agree with Stij that Ryanair attracts the peasants out there. This doesn't mean that the majority of Ryanair passengers aren't decent, normal people. The same is probably true for other ultra low costs such as Wizz Air.

Anyhow, if you keep your passengers waiting in a stable as in Orio al Serio, it's no surprise they behave like cattle.

[Inquirer]

Good afternoon!

I have been browsing a bit on their website this afternoon and most flights are now online, but I must say they are disappointingly expensive for ryanair. As I already noticed on FCO yesterday (see: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=51033&p=289585#p289583), fares for a return tickets to almost all of their destinations hover around the 100 to 150 euro range to start with! If that's how ryanair defines ultra low cost, then there are a whole lot of ultra low cost carriers operating in Europe and at BRU for years!

For those who have a subscription to De Tijd, they also did a more extended comparison (but only on FCO, as that was the only one online yesterday) in today's newspaper and they found that ticket prices are on a par with those of Brussels in almost all cases other than day returns, but do not include complementary things like for instance luggage, making them actually more expensive for the average user, which got defined as a passenger with luggage, a seat choice and an overnight stay!

Interesting reading, but you need a subscription first:
http://www.tijd.be/nieuws/archief/Ryana ... 20Airlines

PS: for those critics: I know I draw a lot from De Tijd, but they do provide good in depth information which goes beyond just quoting from the press releases and copying the slogans.

[sean1982]

Every simulation I did ended up with 50 to 100EUR cheaper with bags included.

[Stij]

Good afternoon!

I have been browsing a bit on their website this afternoon and most flights are now online, but I must say they are disappointingly expensive for ryanair. As I already noticed on FCO yesterday (see: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=51033&p=289585#p289583), fares for a return tickets to almost all of their destinations hover around the 100 to 150 euro range to start with! If that's how ryanair defines ultra low cost, then there are a whole lot of ultra low cost carriers operating in Europe and at BRU for years!

For those who have a subscription to De Tijd, they also did a more extended comparison (but only on FCO, as that was the only one online yesterday) in today's newspaper and they found that ticket prices are on a par with those of Brussels in almost all cases other than day returns, but do not include complementary things like for instance luggage, making them actually more expensive for the average user, which got defined as a passenger with luggage, a seat choice and an overnight stay!

Interesting reading, but you need a subscription first:
http://www.tijd.be/nieuws/archief/Ryana ... 20Airlines

PS: for those critics: I know I draw a lot from De Tijd, but they do provide good in depth information which goes beyond just quoting from the press releases and copying the slogans.

Did they try a day return?

[Didymus]

They did: 330 EUR with Alitalia and SN compared to 49 EUR with Ryanair and 90 EUR with Vueling on the first Saturday of June 2014.

edit:
Correction: these are not day returns but single flights.