Why not Rio as next destination for Brussels Airlines

[flyfred007]

Now that the belgians are qualified, why not open a direct flight to rio !!!

[cathay belgium]

Because their hotel will be in sao paolo
Cxb

[Inquirer]

I understand your euphoria and I share it, but aren't you forgetting a few things, like:
- how much traffic is a qualification bringing? A few thousand Belgians over a 3 week period, it seems.
- are we even going to play in Rio? I thought São Paolo?
- isn't it better to just operate charters ISO running a scheduled route (at a loss) for a prolonged time?

[LJ]

Now that the belgians are qualified, why not open a direct flight to rio !!!

Because a) you cannot run a scheduled service based on soccer fans (not high yield and where are those pax outside the World Cup), b) it's not certain that Belgium has to play in Rio (in fact most of the matches are played outside Rio), c) there isn't much O&D between Rio and Brussels and d) total traffic to Brazil is cooling off as the Brazilean economy is cooling off. The last two will probably the most important reason why SN won't touch Brazil anytime soon.

[CTBke]

most likely they'll charter a plane which is much cheaper ... seeing the current state of SN's fleet and HiFly/White/Euro Atlantic charters they don't have a single A330 on extra...

besides LH and TAP are serving the route already and there are good connections from and to LIS/FRA

[Air Key West]

Air France and KLM are upgrading their services to Brazil. AF will start to fly to Brasilia in 2014.
Even if the economic growth is cooling down, it's still much better than in other countries.
Apparently Belgians are not capable of understanding the importance of Brazil today and still think it is a banana republic, although encouraging their national airline to fly to banana republics elsewhere.
Pathetic.

http://www.air-journal.fr/2013-10-12-ai ... 86845.html

(sorry in French, try Google translation fwiw if you don't read French)

Of course, there is not enough O&D traffic between BRU and Brazil, but is there enough O&D traffic between BRU and other long-haul destinations served by b.air (except FIH) ?

[crlhub]

Gru iso Gig would be the best choice for a future Sn destination.Sabena used to fly down there to GRU but only twice a week with an Md11.It never worked well and the station was closed.Vasp used to fly to SSA/REC/GRU and GIG(not sure 100%).Flights were almost fully booked but very low yield mainly VFR.But since the years 90 or 2000,Brazil has become a very big country(200 millions inhabitants).More important the level of life improved 30%.Eventhough there are still a lot of poors.Very rich Brazilians are really very,very rich believe me(I lived there).The economy is still growing even if at a lower speed.A few big Belgian companies like Solvay have factories there.Of course TAP is the absolute leader on the destination having just added Manaus and Belem non stop to their already large network of Brazilian destinations.For the World Cup a few charters will be enough,one for players,vip,journalists,politics etc..and maybe 2 or 3 more for the fans?Total amount of tickets available for Belgians fans will be very limited and very expensive,and not everyone can spend so much money even a real fan.This is not like going by bus to Croatia or to GLA.But it will be a very good promotional buzz for the country anyway(don't forget that Rio will also holds the Olympics in 2016).One day we will need one BRUGRU link for both business and leisure/vfr.A lot of Brazilian live in Belgium(including my wife and my son.. lol),a vast majority comes from GYN and from the areas near Brasilia and or Belo Horizonte another mega metropolis.They mainly fly with TP or IB,AF being their third choice.
Th Brazilian real lost 25% against the USD/EUR this year,good for us Europeans but not for them down there.

[FLYAIR10]

Apparently Belgians are not capable of understanding the importance of Brazil today

Absolutely agree. The situation is not the same as 10-15 years ago. There is much more potential than most people here seem to imagine. My favourite destination in Brazil would be Sao Paulo. Our company has two plants overthere. we are moving people between Belgium/Europe almost on a weekly basis. Also shipping some 3-5 tons of cargo every week in BOTH directions. Now these are moving through FRA or CDG.
There must be more companies in Belgium and Brazil having similar business relationships.On top of that come EU/government officials ,institutions,constructors,dredgers,sailors,tourists,family visits,Student exchanges,etc. and in 2014 of course soccer fans from Belgium and other European countries...
A direct link between Belgium and Sao Paulo would be more than welcome. Maybe thought could be given to set up a triangle flight BRU-Sao Paulo-Rio-BRU,if that is operationally feasible with the A330-2/3. Otherwise A340's might be a better fit. Just an idea.
Grtz.

[LJ]

Apparently Belgians are not capable of understanding the importance of Brazil today and still think it is a banana republic, although encouraging their national airline to fly to banana republics elsewhere.

The difference between the "banana republics" and Brazil is that the profitability on the "banana republics"is probably higher than SN will ever get with Brazil. A BRU-GRU-BRU is a very expensive flight due to the duration. Moreover, the competition is higher thus lower yield (and SN will have to do a daylight flight to Brazil, which will hurt yields). If you yake higher costs and lower yield, it's easy to see why SN aka LH will hesitate to start BRU - Brazil.

[BigJets]

..Sabena used to fly down there to GRU but only twice a week with an Md11.It never worked well and the station was closed.Vasp used to fly to SSA/REC/GRU and GIG(not sure 100%).Flights were almost fully booked...

Yes, Sabena used to fly to Sao Paulo (began flying to GRU in May 1998) and it was closed but not for the reasons you may think. Sabena was boycotted in every possible way. At the time, Varig was the main player in Brazil but, just like their main rival VASP, they were struggling financially. From the people I knew there and what I witnessed myself over there, Varig threatened major travel agencies (at the risk of lowering their commissions and losing other advantages) warning them not to sell Sabena tickets. Cargo had also been "sabotaged", keeping merchandise blocked at customs for weeks! The Sabena offices in Sao Paulo began with a desk and a chair. The phone didn't work for days and all advertising material (Lighting signs, posters, timetables, you name it...) was stuck at customs! Some of you may think, well Brazil is a "banana republic" and it's normal that things such as customs or requests for phone lines take time but this was clearly over the top.
It was really sad to see but it made me realize how much of a threat Sabena seemed to be in the eyes of Varig. Well, their tactics worked and it was clear that Sabena could not continue to function properly under such circumstances. Don't get me wrong, there are still good possibilities for a BRU-Sao Paulo route.
Sabena was very good when it came to market studies. If you want to know what future destinations there will (eventually) be out of Brussels, just look at where Sabena used to fly. The only exception may be destinations to "partner", code-share hubs which were used mainly as feeder flights. Whether Brussels Airlines will operate the flights or someone else remains to be seen.
If you don't operate a route yourself, then eventually someone else will.

[crew1990]

I also think that SN could start flying to Sao Paulo using a A330-200.

Now that TAM is leaving Star Alliance, it's time for another company from the group to start the flights.

[Bracebrace]

I think people here underestimate the way the country Brasil thinks and works - politically and economically. The country protects itself from foreign influences like no other country does. Brasil is a country of opportunities, oh yes, and maybe SNBru could start a Brasil flight... But you are looking at the case from your own point of view, thinking we as Europeans can go there without asking questions and earn money based on their investments (the worldcup is a big investment after all). Brasil on the other hand will look at it in a different perspective and will react very protective.

There are a lot of possibilities in Brasil, it's a growing and booming nation but still quite some steps behind compared to ie our European level (if you can call it a "level"). But they will do everything to make sure Brasil retains the profit made from the growth, so the money doesn't go to outsiders. Even if it means it delays the growth a couple of years. They don't care.

[sn26567]

As things are developing now, the Belgian Red Devils and their supporters will fly to Brazil with Air France and KLM:

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=51405

[carllegein]

Gentleman we do almost 100 footbal charters per year, we had 500 pax to ZAG, even more to GLA, we are working hard for a shuttle to Brazil during the WK. Schedules will be ready first week of December. Our ambition is minimum 5 wide bodies per match

[LJ]

As things are developing now, the Belgian Red Devils and their supporters will fly to Brazil with Air France and KLM:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=51405

Oh well, the Dutch and Belgian team share a sponsor, and if true they can also share a plane.

Gentleman we do almost 100 footbal charters per year, we had 500 pax to ZAG, even more to GLA, we are working hard for a shuttle to Brazil during the WK. Schedules will be ready first week of December. Our ambition is minimum 5 wide bodies per match

There is a difference between a charter in Europe and long haul. Just look at the number of charters from Europe to the World Championship in Johannesburg. The number was very very limited. Basically we´ll probably going to see the same for Brazil as the price will be an important factor for people.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I agree with you LJ. He better organize full eco 747's to Brazil, with a ticket price lower then 500, otherwise the amibition of 5 widebodies will not materialize.

[carllegein]

talk to you in 9 months and see what we gave birth at Aviation Factory for the WK

[cathay belgium]

Hi,
The dutch didn't had a problem for their longhauls to joburg four years ago!
Hellenic Airways 743, HiFly A346, Euroatlantic B767, guess it will be a spotter super summer in BRU!
HAdj operators can fill the gap!
CXB

[FLYAIR10]

we are working hard for a shuttle to Brazil during the WK. Schedules will be ready first week of December. Our ambition is minimum 5 wide bodies per match

Great!. Would suggest there is at least one widebody from OST and one from LGG. Rest from BRU.
Grtz.

[sn26567]

As things are developing now, the Belgian Red Devils and their supporters will fly to Brazil with Air France and KLM

... or TAP Portugal, which will launch Manaus and Belem services in 2014.