Low cost carriers : how do they do it? (tv program)

[Passenger]

On 28th December 2012, Dutch tv program KRO Reporter published an broadcast about Ryanair's fuel policy, mainly based upon an interview with 4 Ryanair pilots - already discussed in the topic "Three Ryanair emergency landings in Valencia on same day". Link:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=48045&start=180

On 3th Jan 2013 (21h10), KRO Reporter will show episod 2: “the world behind your cheap ticket”. Short announcement on their site: “Where do low cost carriers save money? How safe is your flight to Dublin, Rome or Madrid?”. Link:
http://reporter.kro.nl/seizoenen/2013/a ... 03-01-2013

Meanwhile, KRO Reporter has put an international version of it’s first episod Mayday Mayday online. Link:
http://reporter.kro.nl/seizoenen/2012/a ... al_version

(homepage KRO Reporter: http://reporter.kro.nl)

[Mirror]

Oh god...Top Journalism for sure !

[Boeing767copilot]

more info on:

http://reporter.kro.nl/seizoenen/2013/a ... 03-01-2013

[tolipanebas]

The second episode is going to cause a stir just as much as the first one it seems.

http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/econo ... ir_piloten

[Passenger]

The second episode is going to cause a stir just as much as the first one it seems.

http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/econo ... ir_piloten

Short tranlation : Ryanair pilots sometimes fly when they should report themselves in as sick or mentally unable to fly. Testimony by a FR-captain. Ryanair denies.

[cnc]

the FR PR from luchtzak is rather silent on these topics ... but i remain sceptical about such testimonies and journalistic.

[airazurxtror]

For me (I guess I am one of the alleged FR PR ?) I am fed up with all that crap.
Walloon proverb : "quand on vou batt on tchin, on trouve todis on baston" - tradutore traditore, but I'll try to translate : when you have in mind to beat a dog, you always manage to find a stick.

[Passenger]

For me (I guess I am one of the alleged FR PR ?) I am fed up with all that crap.
Walloon proverb : "quand on vou batt on tchin, on trouve todis on baston" - tradutore traditore, but I'll try to translate : when you have in mind to beat a dog, you always manage to find a stick.

We have a verb in Dutch that says: "de maskers vallen eindelijk af". Translated: the masks finally fall off. Meaning: the truth finally comes up.

[sdbelgium]

Meaning: the truth finally comes up.

A truth which is not only valid for Ryanair, cfr. Incident: Air Berlin A332 at Munich on May 5th 2012, tired crew declared PAN.

[tolipanebas]

As with everything at LCCs, the legal limit has become the only reference and their sole safety net.

The problem with the European flight time / rest time regulation is that the regulator has listened too much to the operators and has drawn a set of unsafe rules which allow EU pilots to fly for much longer than their American counterparts, as if somehow a European pilot is less prone to fatigue than American pilots?

Up until a few years ago, most European airlines stayed well clear of the max duty / min rest rules, thus making these rules nothing but a guidance around the zone to stay well clear off at all times, but increased competition from airlines which seek a competitive advantage from exploiting all of the legal limits to their fullest means more and more pilots are now being asked to fly when they are no longer fit, with the excuse that what they are asked to do is allowed (in Europe) and already done by others (like Ryanair).

In the USA, the regulator has understood they do not have to count on the self-regulation by the operators in the face if very stiff competition and has thus decided to use scientific data to determine new max duty / min rest rules, with the consequence of those rules being far far stricter than what Europe currently allows: what is used by some airlines in Europe today may be perfectly legal, yet that doesn't make it safe! In fact many pairings flown by EU airlines today, would be illegal in the USA for instance.

It's high time for Europe to refer ONLY to scientific data and to level the playing field upwards just as the USA have done, rather than insist on hanging their ultimate safety net so low that basically everything is possible under it, while counting on airlines to use their common sense and apply stricter rules themselves, because common sense is not part of the business plan at some airlines.

http://www.eurocockpit.be/node/1404. and http://www.dead-tired.eu.

[fcw]

As with everything at LCCs, the legal limit has become the only reference and their sole safety net.

The problem with the European flight time / rest time regulation is that the regulator has listened too much to the operators and has drawn a set of unsafe rules which allow EU pilots to fly for much longer than their American counterparts, as if somehow a European pilot is less prone to fatigue than American pilots?

Up until a few years ago, most European airlines stayed well clear of the max duty / min rest rules, but increased competition from airlines which seek a competitive advantage from exploiting all of the legal limits to their fullest means more and more pilots are being asked to fly when they are no longer fit, with the excuse that wat they are asked to do is allowed (in Europe) and already done by others (like Ryanair).

Fully agree with you sir, the new EASA rules are a much bigger threat to saftey than flying around with minimum legal fuel.
But at least in Ryanair 5 working days are followed by 4 off days.
As for working whilst sick or tired: most FR pilots are self employed, so if they don't work they don't have any salary, just as with all other self employed people (eg: plumbers, doctors, some BruAir pilots...)
The advantage of being self employed is a salary of +10000€/month, the downside is no money when sick. Some off them are tempted to come to work whilst feeling sick because they want the money, BUT it is NOT the company putting pressure on them to come to work.

[sn26567]

In the USA, the regulator has understood they do not have to count on the self-regulation by the operators in the face if very stiff competition and has thus decided to use scientific data to determine new max duty / min rest rules, with the consequence of those rules being far far stricter than what Europe currently allows: what is used by some airlines in Europe today may be perfectly legal, yet that doesn't make it safe! In fact many pairings flown by EU airlines today, would be illegal in the USA for instance.

Which rules apply to European companies flying to the US: European rules or US rules? Same question for US companies flying to Europe or within Europe (cabotage)?

[fcw]

Which rules apply to European companies flying to the US: European rules or US rules? Same question for US companies flying to Europe or within Europe (cabotage)?

Pilots have to respect the rules published in their OM A.

[Passenger]

Just a quick reminder:

second episod is tonight, NED2, at 21h10.

[quixoticguide]

part 2 is also available on-line.