Boeing 787 news

[bruteboeing]

...It becomes predictable, everytime I post something in this topic it is often already outdated...

ANA has confirmed that the 3rd delivery for a 787 is delayed to later this month (it was supposed to be delivered somewhere in November). The reason is the wiring...A routine FAA inspection of the next 3 787 to delivered found wiring that was installed incorrectly. According to Boeing the problem is "well understood" at this moment and is not "spread out throughout the aircraft". They call the wiring problems: "minor".

Another problem...3 failing APU's. The next few aircraft to be delivered are at this moment fitted with working APU's. But there were 3 aircraft that had APU's that refused to start up for the first time. These are not fully Boeing's responsibility and they are working out the problems with Hamilton Sundstrand which is the manufacterer of the APU's.

Sources familiar with this problem said the APU's are often used on the 787's on the flight line to run some systems like cabin air compressors. This is because there isn't enough power to run all the necessary tests on the flightline for all these aircraft (watch the pictures and you see what the problem is...). This isn't really a problem as they use the APU's normally...bad luck some are failing...delaying some of the testings... But this is not the direct reason for the delay of the next few deliveries as these have all working APU's, the wiring is the problem there.

You wonder if this ever going to end... And looking at the production problems Airbus is still facing with the A380 after all these years, I think we've not seen the last of this 787-disaster...

Why do you think they bring out AD's and SB's during maintenance... they will always keep finding snags on every model they create, some might be big, some might be nothing...

[RoMax]

Why do you think they bring out AD's and SB's during maintenance... they will always keep finding snags on every model they create, some might be big, some might be nothing...

Yes of course, but with the 787 the things are just building up so quickly...the delays get bigger every month... ANA was supposed to start flying to PEK with the 787 around now, they delayed this to 14 January which results in only a few flights to PEK until that 787 starts flying to FRA. The planned frequency increase in February for the HND-FRA route can't be performed with 787, resulting in a 772 to take over flights on certain days of the week...and this is only for the first airline to operate the 787, for many the delays are even bigger.

Saying "well yeay, that's normal for every aircraft, they all have their problems" doesn't help the airlines that are waiting for their 787's 3-4 years (for some the delays are running up to almost 5 years) longer than planned...

[RoMax]

Now they are planning 3 more 787 deliveries this month...one on 27th December and two on 30th December... There are Boeing employees working through during the Christmas holidays to get these ready and also the preperation of the GE 787 that will perform ETOPS testing for the GE engines is delayed because as much people as possible focus on getting these 3 787's to ANA this month.

As said before there are currently 9 748F's delivered and probably there will no 747 deliveries this month anymore. So IF they get 3 787's delivered this month, there will be 5 787's delivered. That makes a total of 14...while Boeing's last plan was 15-20 747's and 787's combined this year of which 2/3 748's... It's indeed 2/3 for 748, but they did not even achieve the lower end of their expectations...and these expectations where already down from the 25-40 planned earlier this year, later it was 25-30 and now 15-20 which they didn't even achieved...

Also about the 748F, RC602/ VQ-BLQ made it's first flight. This will be the first one to be delivered to AirBridgeCargo (probably early/mid January). It was the second build 748 for ABC, but is now marked as the first to be delivered (probably more rework on the first one, while this one needed only very limited rework).

http://paineairport.com/kpae4541.htm

[RoMax]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TuH5Yw8 ... r_embedded

Initial engine run on another 787, based on the tail for JAL or AI. (note the small fireball in the beginning)
The more unusual thing about is that the engines were run for a shorter time than planned and that the Fire Department was called to investigate a 40 gallon fuel spill.

A bit more information about the 787's that are planned to be delivered. Airplanes 31 (JA805A), 41 (JA807A) and 9 (JA804A) are all performing Boeing and customer test flights. These have to get to ANA within 7-9 days. This is an extremely tight shedule. Airplane 31 shouldn't be a problem, this one started customer flight evaluations on Wednesday. But also his testing wasn't without 'small' problems. On 9 December he declared an emergency and returned to the airport. He had a flap issue.
L/N 41 made it's first flight on Monday and 9 returned to flying on Wednesday (but this one has already flown to do the ETOPS and F&R testing for the 787 Trent 1000). This is a very short time to get all the pre-delivery testing done...(at least for this program).

At least one of these 3 787's has the international long haul interior of ANA with just 158 (!) seats and the improved Trent 1000 Package B engines which were certified recently and bring the fuel usage within 1% of what RR promised (Package C which will improve performance further is in ground testing with RR).

For the rest, FAL is reliably running at 2,5/month and the amount of rework on the 787's that are now produced is declining rapidly. But they still need rework and together with the big amount of 787's out on the flightline the amount of work is extremely big. Which is shown by the 3 airplanes that will be delivered this month: 31 and 41 are both quite recent 787's and 9 already underwent rework before ETOPS and F&R testing (only the preperation for ANA was needed, so interior, removal of test equipment,...)

[hunterbruce]

Many Thks - MR
You can post a heads up here, followed by an email with other data if sensitive etc..

[tsv]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TuH5Yw8 ... r_embedded

Initial engine run on another 787, based on the tail for JAL or AI. (note the small fireball in the beginning)
The more unusual thing about is that the engines were run for a shorter time than planned and that the Fire Department was called to investigate a 40 gallon fuel spill.

Geez man, you're still obviously determined to prevent me obtaining any confidence in this aircraft. At least there wasn't a "small explosion" from the "small fireball" I suppose

[RoMax]

Geez man, you're still obviously determined to prevent me obtaining any confidence in this aircraft. At least there wasn't a "small explosion" from the "small fireball" I suppose

Don't worry, by the time these 787's leave Boeing they are quite 'ok'.

And no, I don't think there was worrying explosion...in that case I don't think the engine test run would have been continued.
An initial smokey engine run, sometimes with these kind of small fireballs, are not unusual (because of oil and other chemicals/materials that are in the engine and are being combusted during the first engine run). The strange thing about this was that the test run was shorter than planned because of leaking fuel.

Many of these 787's have small problems during initial system tests, often caused by the long time they are waiting outside for rework. As you probably read in some of my previous posts, also 3 APU's refused to start up. These were send back to the manufacturer (as these are not build/designed by Boeing). But in the end (at delivery) they are all OK... (I hope )

[RoMax]

After MoU/LoI's (don't know which exactly, but doesn't matter really) for the A380 and B748i, Transaero also signed for 4 Boeing 787's, for fleet renewal.

Olga Pleshakova said the airline was "sticking to a principle of innovation" with the decision. The airline already made advance payments to secure the 787's, which will replace the 767's of the airline.

This aircraft, which has become a symbol of emerging technology, has the highest efficiency.

said Pleshakova.

Wonder if they'll also order the A350... Like they first signed for the A380 and shortly after that also for the 748i. Recently they also firmed up an order for 8 A320neo.

[sn26567]

Now they are planning 3 more 787 deliveries this month...one on 27th December and two on 30th December... There are Boeing employees working through during the Christmas holidays to get these ready and also the preperation of the GE 787 that will perform ETOPS testing for the GE engines is delayed because as much people as possible focus on getting these 3 787's to ANA this month.

Once again, Boeing couldn't keep up with its promises and missed the deadline; the third "Dreamliner" did reach Tokyo only yesterday (4 January), although "officially" ANA took possession of the aircraft on 30 December.

This aircraft has a well-suited name: it is a "dream" rather than a reality for most of its customers!

[RoMax]

Indeed...JA805A (the first one for international operations) was contractually delivered on 30 December and this is seen by both ANA and Boeing as the official delivery date. But it was flown to HND yesterday...JA807A was also planned to be delivered...but suprise suprise...it didn't happen. Second try today...
JA804A unknown...

Also JA806A is supposed to be delivered this month...wonder if that will ever happen...

[RoMax]

Since 1 November two 787's of ANA are in regular service on two domestic routes and after two and a half months they achieve a dispatch reliability of 96,3%. This is nearly matching the fleet wide reliability of 96,5%.

Also the loadfactor on the 787's fligt is higher than average. The 787-operated flights from HND to Hiroshima and Okayama have a an average of 88% compared to 72,2% for all flights on these two routes. This is up from 67,7% in the previous year.

ANA expects to carry its 100,000th 787 passenger on 15 January on a flight from Hiroshima to HND.

Currently the 2 787's operate two domestic flights a day. On 14, 17 and 18 January ANA will fly to PEK with the first international 787 (arrived in HND on 4 January) before starting flights to Frankfurt out of HND. These flights start on 21 January.
Today operations on the domestic routes are also expanded. Hiroshima and Okayama will get two daily 787 flights each. Domestic flights to Yamaguchi Ube and Osaka Itami will start on 23 January.
After the start of the new financial year on 1 April also flights to Matuyama out of Haneda and Seattle (going back to its roots :p )and San Jose (California) out of Narita.

About the deliveries:

- 4th 787 delivered on 12 January (contractually, no delivery flight yet, is about to come today or in the next few days)
- 5th 787 should be delivered today with delivery flight in the comming days.

And last but not least...after the first two 787's got a special paint. The rest of the 787's will also be a bit different from the rest of the fleet. On the front fuselage "787" is painted in big blue on the aircraft. JA805A which was flown to HND on 4 January (in regular ANA livery) was placed in a paint hangar quite fast to come out with it's new look on 12 January.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/All-Nipp ... 2048118/L/

[RoMax]

5th 787 is delivered to ANA this week. If I'm correct they now have 3 domestic 787's and 2 international configured 787's. The 3 domestic 787's are the earliest build and because of that the most heavy (with the worst performance).

The next one to be delivered is JA806A (L/N40) which appeared on the flight line earlier this week (with the new big 787 titles of ANA), it passed the previous months in the EMC for rework.
JA806A was planned to make a B-1 flight on 20 January, but before that several tests have to be performed on the flight line and it seems very unlikely they will get this done before the end of the week. This time the reason is not Boeing or the 787 problems but the weather in the Pacific Northwest. There is a winter storm going over this area in the comming days, making it almost impossible to do outside tests. For today also the Future of Flight and Boeing Tour will be closed due to the weather.

JA806A had to be delivered on 30 January, but this will probably shift to the right.

Also the certification flights of the GE 787's are delayed (again...), also due to the weather. L/N35 (VT-ANH for Air India) was quite ready for its first departure on Monday but because of the weather the flight was cancelled for unkown time. This aircraft has to perform a part of the ETOPS and F&R testing for the GE 787, the other part was performed by ZA006 late 2011 but the FAA requires a part to be performed by a production aircraft.

If testing goes smooth Boeing wants to deliver the first GE 787 to JAL at the end of February, but this seems less likely if VT-ANH can't take of fast and without problems. Normally the GE 787 had to be certified late 2011, but rumours say the reason for the delay is lightning protection around they engine pylons for the GEnx-1B engines. These pylons are slightly different to the RR engines, and this problem proved to be new for the GE powered 787's.

[RoMax]

ANA also announced they will introduce a new domestic interior on their 788's... Current 787's (in domestic configuration) have 264 seats: 12 premium (2-2-2) and 252 economy (2-4-2).
The new domestic configuration will have 335 seats. 12 in premium (2-2-2) and 323 seats in economy (3-3-3). The seats in ecnomy will be new designed light weight seats...compareble with the Recaro seats of the LH Group. So providing the same or a bit more leg room but the overall space will decrease (also because there will be 9 seats next to eachother compared to 8 now)... So far the quite comfortable domestic configuration of ANA on the 787...

The long haul configuration will stay the same with 158 seats: 46 premium seats (1-1-1 and 1-2-1) and 112 economy seats (2-4-2).

Back at the moment ANA showed their initial aircraft they said they would reconfigurate their domestic 787's to a regional configuration with 222 seats (42 premium (configuration unkown), 180 economy (2-4-2)). But apperently they decided not to, or they are planning to operate 3 different configurations: domestic, regional (short international flights) and long haul.

[sn26567]

The first comercial flight of a B787-800 to a European destination has left Tokyo 3 hours ago and is en route to Frankfurt. Flight ANA/NH203 from Tokyo Haneda (HND/RJTT) to Frankfurt (FRA/EDDF) can be followed life on a site like FlightAware: http://fr.flightaware.com/live/flight/ANA203.

I guess there will be a flock of spotters to welcome it in about 8 hours from now.

[sn26567]

I guess there will be a flock of spotters to welcome it in about 8 hours from now.

... although I doubt there will be many of them at the expected time of arrival, 4:38 am. But the fire brigade should be there for the water salute!

[earthman]

I guess there will be a flock of spotters to welcome it in about 8 hours from now.

... although I doubt there will be many of them at the expected time of arrival, 4:38 am.

That's how you can tell the men from the boys.

[sn26567]

Boeing is embarrassed. Air India’s accounts became public last week with the airline noting that it paid just under US$110m for its first 787. The list price, available on the internet, is US$193m.

[RoMax]

Boeing is embarrassed. Air India’s accounts became public last week with the airline noting that it paid just under US$110m for its first 787. The list price, available on the internet, is US$193m.

This was admitted by Boeing already a long time ago... It was said they gave discounts up to 80% for some frames in the early years. Later the discounts were significant lower, the orders since let's say 2010 are 'normal'. The discounts now are normal (read: still high discounts, as you always see, depending the order and the customer), but they still have a lot to cover but that was known already in 2009... This is just the first time we know exact prices paid by a certain airline.

[cnc]

Boeing is embarrassed. Air India’s accounts became public last week with the airline noting that it paid just under US$110m for its first 787. The list price, available on the internet, is US$193m.

is this not because they bought 787's without engines?

[RoMax]

is this not because they bought 787's without engines?

No, prices include engines, and if I'm correct they also bought two (if I remember well) spare engines. But these two spare engines were not included in the individual prices for the 787's. So it is 109-111 million (depending to the frame) dollar per 787 with engines.