SN obliges b.light passengers to use self check-in in BRU

[BRUCPH]

Last week I was booked on a flight to Gothenburg with SN. I went - as I always do - to BRU airport to check-in at the counters. But I was refused to check-in at the counters and had to go to the self check-in machines. But as I had not printed the e-ticket, I didn't had the booking reference and could not use the machines. I never printed my e-tickets as checking in at the counters was based on my ID-card or M&M-card. So after trying several times and occupying the machine for several minutes, a SN hostess came to tell me to go to the ticketing office to retrieve my booking reference. There was a queue as I was not the only one without his/her booking reference.

With this booking reference I again had to queue for the self check-in. In front of me was an older lady (I guess 70+) who also never used the check-in machines and had quite some troubles using the machine and more specific the touch-screen (she probably never used a touch screen before). After she tried for some minutes, she asked me whether I could help her out. Finally checked-in, I had to go to the (former) check-in counters to drop-off my luggage.

I think SN made a bad decision her to deny b.light customers to use check-in counters. Some people prefer the personal contact or cannot handle these machines very well. I also do not understand how this can be a cost saving for SN: the number of counters was only slightly decreased, they still have to staff the counters for luggage drop-off (which is the most time-consuming part of the check-in I guess) and they have to schedule more staff for denying the passengers and referring them to the self check-in and they increased the staff in the ticketing office to deal with booking problems formerly dealt with by the check-in staff.

My conclusion: this decision degrades SN's service further to the low-cost segment direction. For the 470 EUR payed for my return trip to Gothenburg, which is not at all a low-cost price, I expect at least some service.

[sn26567]

I experienced the same in Vienna with Austrian Airlines already 2 years ago. There ALL passengers had to use the self check-in machines, and only passengers with specific problems could go to the check-in counters. There were several hostesses and stewards to help passengers who had trouble using the machines.

This is a regression of service. The human touch of checking in is disappearing. A pity, if you ask me.

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

Again I see SN and FR coming more close to eachother with FR as a trendsetter
Bad perspectives IMHO.. personal contact can point out the difference between low-cost and a full service carrier.. and BTW what's the difference for check-in agents, 2 minutes as they still need to take care of luggage..

CX-B

PS Airtravel again lost some of it former style/class/way of travel..

[airazurxtror]

Well, I have just self-checked with Germanwings at Schönefeld, and I liked it : just typed my reservation code, chose my seat on the screen and instantly got my boarding card.
At Maastricht, the check-in was at the desk, the girl did not understand what I wanted and instead of an A seat, she gave me an F one, with the sun in the eyes all the way to SXF ...

[dna]

SAS is doing the same in Scandinavia and it is also working great!

I have to disagree with you there. It was impossible to do a self check-in at Arlanda recently without a booking reference, which I did not have. When I contacted the supervisor, she was extremely rude and said she didn't have the time to retrieve it for me (even though she wasn't doing anything else). I did end up at the only staffed check-in counter (economy) available. An awful experience.

I have had great self check-in experiences with Qantas in Brisbane and Sydney (by simply using my Qantas Frequent Flyer card), and with American Airlines in Chicago and Montreal (with my passport barcode). So if the process is well thought out, it doesn't bother me.

Again I see SN and FR coming more close to eachother with FR as a trendsetter

Before comparing SN to FR, you may want to take a look at what most US carriers are doing now, or Qantas for that matter. Qantas domestic has even done away with staffed bag-drop counters, the entire process has been automated and it works well.

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

Before comparing SN to FR, you may want to take a look at what most US carriers are doing now, or Qantas for that matter. Qantas domestic has even done away with staffed bag-drop counters, the entire process has been automated and it works well.

Don't know anything about Quantas but I guess Aussies are more used to fly ?
Are there numbers about the fly-ability of europeans against US/Aussies?

As I see BRU Airport, the most of the people still uses the check-in desks / bags drops,..
Don't know numbers just what I see..
Don't mean the bussiness pax but the general public who don't fly more than once/twice a year..

Don't say we can't,won't deal with this change but I don't think we must be happy about it..

And if they changed policy we could have been made aware of this fact, never had a mail of them and I have/had bookings for sept-nov-dec-jan-feb-.. and last time I checked my email , no

CX-B

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

BTW will see my grandfather 90+ checking in at home-no-, at these little machines he never saw before, speaking only italian,... that's the spirit now ? haha
Indeed, what will he fly next time after such an experience, guess what ?

CX-B

[regi]

If such a device gives you the error message, it is not forbidden to reset that device yourself because you were obliged to operate it. Try to unplug electricity. Plug it in again and wait.

If staff appears, great ! They might give you a hand.

[regi]

BTW: am I right that those things are not/less used with charter airlines because they know that those passengers have less experience with procedures ?

[regi]

My conclusion: this decision degrades SN's service further to the low-cost segment direction. For the 470 EUR payed for my return trip to Gothenburg, which is not at all a low-cost price, I expect at least some service.

I do fully agree that 470 € return Copenhagen is way too much. But do you know how much such kind of intra Europe / midweek flight costed 15-20 years ago? At least 20,000 Belgian Francs.
So the prices have not gone down or increased. Everything around has changed. Less or no service, food & beverage, email/internet...

I do accept and understand your frustration. But in these days of computers, I think ( read: I hope ) that statistics will show the benefit of all those systems. Not only for the companies. Also for the passengers:
Less overbookings, own choices, speed ( if everything goes OK ), traceability etcetera.

What speed concerns: it is utterly frustrating when those devices give an error message. But I have stood numerous times at check in counters ( worldwide) when the check in person said "please wait a second, the system is out". That second became sometimes half an hour.
Some small other points:
"Oops, my printer doesn't work anymore" Or: "I don't know how to put a new roll in my boarding pass printer, I have to ask my colleague "
And how often did we not hear that a passenger had asked for a window seat, he receives his boarding pass, and when he comes in the plane, he finds out he has a middle seat.
Friendly check in personnel is great. But I have undergone also the torture of the opposite several times.
Look dear members, I don't want to sound as an alpha male type. But sometimes I was thinking by myself when the annoyed check in lady couldn't hide her frustration that she had to work that day "Hey, couldn't you simply stay home ?"

[shockcooling]

Or just check in online from home 24hrs before!!!

[Flanker]

For once, Luchtzak seems to agree unanimously.

I don't see the point of this system when you offer free checked luggage and most people will need to queue at the check-in to drop off their luggage anyway. If checked luggage is free, most people will use it.
With this system, you save 2 check-in lanes to add 2 people to assist the self check-in.
And the queues become longer and longer.

I suppose that it would eliminate around 30 check-in positions, save 1 million euro per year.
If a check-in staff sees 150 pax/day or 30.000 pax per year, 30 check-in staff see roughly 1 million pax per year. This means that 50% of SN's outbound short-haul pax will have to go through an extra inconvenience to save SN 1 euro on each of these pax.
Yes, self check-in is only a convenience for pax with only hand luggage who CAN print their own e-pass and WANT to go straight through security and to the gate.
It's an inconvenience for all the pax who need to go to a check-in counter anyway to drop their luggage or people who can't use a computer or don't want to print an e-pass.

The 60+ generation who still book their tickets in travel agencies or with help through internet, and specifically choose SN for these kind of services to avoid self check-in, can now just as well consider Ryanair and spend the extra money to book a better hotel or go to better restaurants.

Airlines who sell return fares of 40€ can afford to treat passengers like an inconvenience, but can airlines who sell fares of 470€ do the same?

If you want to stay in business in a bad economic climate, don't cut on customer service or on safety!

[BRUCPH]

I do accept and understand your frustration. But in these days of computers, I think ( read: I hope ) that statistics will show the benefit of all those systems. Not only for the companies. Also for the passengers:
Less overbookings, own choices, speed ( if everything goes OK ), traceability etcetera.

I agree, also the human systems are not error-free, but I'm challenging the success stories and benefits of the computer systems from my own experience. I also see advantages of automated check-in systems when they work fluently. They also already saved me time (and facilitated me to be in time for my flight) when the queues for the check-in counters were enormous after an EU summit in CPH. But
1) the systems have to work, what is not always the case (see the statement by airbuske)
2) you still should offer the passengers the choice to use them or not.

Again, I'm challenging the benefits of the systems
1) Staff reduction: do not see a difference with before, there are less check-in counters available, but more staff is needed to block passengers off from going to the check-in counters, to assist illiterate passengers at the machines, and to handle passengers who receive error messages at the machines. Moreover, you still need staff to accept the baggage
2) less overbookings. That I seriously challenge. In the old days, only people checked-in who were physically at the airport. So once checked in, it was very unlikely these passengers won't show up for their flight. Now, passengers book up to 24 hours before the flight leaves. Several reasons can result in a no-show at the airport (getting sick, family matters, being stuck in traffic jams, missing the train, ...). But they already checked in, their seats are booked. So it is only after boarding the system can see they haven't shown up and so their seat can be assigned to an overbooked passenger.
3) own choices: when I check in online or at the machine, a seat is already assigned and when I try to change this seat, it is very unlikely I will be able to find a "better" seat. When checking in at the counter, the agents where sometimes able to assign a "better" seat.

[airazurxtror]

The 60+ generation who still book their tickets in travel agencies or with help through internet

You have a huge misconception of the "60+ generation" abilities !

[wernerrav4]

I am suprised to read that all B-Light passengers are asked to check in on the automatic counters.
I flew with BRU air and with a B-Light ticket to VCE ( flight 3205) last wednesday and nobody asked something,was I lucky or is it a try-out?

[sn26567]

The 60+ generation who still book their tickets in travel agencies or with help through internet

You have a huge misconception of the "60+ generation" abilities !

You took the words out of my mouth!

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

sn26567 and airazur.. haha I just can't put you 2 to the 'average' 60+ boyz !

You're from a special kind haha, don't see this all ( checking in on machines or/with internet )going so easy with my parents/parents in law..offcourse more and more 60+ are more conveniant with PC but I guess the most of them still start to panic..

But not just elder people, people (young and old ) which won't travel by air once /twice a year will put on a funny face when you ask their reference number or eticket..

CX-B

[Air Key West]

All airlines, in the end, will want pax to do the whole check-in process themselves (including putting the luggage tag on the suitcase and putting the suitcase on the luggage belt).
What I often see now is that if I travel in eco and haven't printed my boarding card at home, I have to queue at the check-in machine AND at the baggage drop off. So, it means queueing twice. The alternative is to print you boarding card before leaving for the airport, but that is not always possible.
Self check-in at home or in the office is OK and let's you choose your seat yourself, but at the airport it's often a drag.

[regi]

small question: to get your airmiles, is it also not better to talk to a real person?
( in case that you did not do a website booking )

And something you cannot ask a machine: "Can I get an upgrade?"

[airbuske]

small question: to get your airmiles, is it also not better to talk to a real person?
( in case that you did not do a website booking )

And something you cannot ask a machine: "Can I get an upgrade?"

You can enter your FQTV number when doing the self check-in

And upgrades we do only at the gate in case of overbooking
except when you would like to upgrade against miles