Aircraft orders at Farnborough 2010

[RoMax]

BTW: Boeing has updated his O&D sheat on their website. So now a part of the previous unidentified orders are showed with their real customers and new orders are added. Strangly enough there is no single sign of the Air Lease Corp. order for 54 738's. Maybe it's not really firmed yet?
A list of total orders for this year, so far:

B737: 235 gross orders => 7 cancelations => 228 nett orders
B747: 1 nett orders (business jet)
B767: 3 nett orders
B777: 50 gross orders => 14 cancelations => 36 nett orders
B787: 28 gross orders => 17 cancelations => 11 nett orders
Total: 317 gross orders => 38 cancelations => 279 nett orders

279 YTD orders is already much higher than the total of 2009 and Boeing said they expect some 748 and 787 orders later this year. So I'm happy.

BTW: Boeing has participated for the first time since a long time in the order race at a big airshow (normally they don't have many orders at an airshow), and we see the result. They have even more orders as Airbus and as Boeing was already leading in the YTD orders for this year Boeing is doing a good job this year. Thanks to the 737 wich seems to be very popular (again).
But of course Airbus did a great job to with 133 orders.

[DC3 Fan]

http://tinyurl.com/2d6ylu9

[tolipanebas]

Boeing has participated for the first time since a long time in the order race at a big airshow (normally they don't have many orders at an airshow), and we see the result.

Euh, mind you, this is the second big sales event this year, afte the ILA in Berlin only just over a month ago where EK absolutely wanted to steal the show and announce 32 A380s by total surprise. Never understood why they didn't want to wait till Farnborough with that one actually; surely not because they were scared somebody else might dwarf this order?

Also, it now seems several of the 'firm orders' Boeing has announced over the week, haven't actually been signed yet as they've only booked 103 firm orders today?

[RoMax]

Euh, mind you, this is the second big sales event this year, afte the ILA in Berlin only just over a month ago where EK absolutely wanted to steal the show and announce 32 A380s by total surprise. Never understood why they didn't want to wait till Farnborough with that one actually; surely not because they were scared somebody else might dwarf this order?

Also, it now seems several of the 'firm orders' Boeing has announced over the week, haven't actually been signed yet as they've only booked 103 firm orders today?

Ok ILA was a Airbus event, but even with that 32 order of Emirates they were still behind Boeing in the "YTD orders race" because Airbus had only very few A32S sold in the first months of this year while Boeing sold very much 737's.
But I was talking about Farnborough on its own. Normally Boeing announce only a few big orders at an airshow, Airbus is always the big winner at the big airshows. For the first time since a very long time Boeing participated in the orders race at an airshow. And we see the result at the Farnborough Airshow.

About the only 103 booked orders. I'll quote myself:

Strangly enough there is no single sign of the Air Lease Corp. order for 54 738's. Maybe it's not really firmed yet?

It's just one order they didn't booked, the 54 738's for Air Lease Corp. No idea what's the reason for that. Altough this order was announced as a new firmed order. I wonder if Airbus will book their Air Lease Corp. order (51 A32S) or not. If they do that, they will have more orders than Boeing at this airshow, but still Boeing did a good job.
This is not the kind of Boeing we are used to see at an airshow, and I want to make that clear.

[sdbelgium]

Ok ILA was a Airbus event, but even with that 32 order of Emirates they were still behind Boeing in the "YTD orders race" because Airbus had only very few A32S sold in the first months of this year while Boeing sold very much 737's.

So what? I'd rather have 32 A380's in my order book, than 50 B737's. It's not all about the amount of orders, but the nett value of the orders. Anyone with a comparison between A and B for that? I bet they're not that far behind...

[RoMax]

So what? I'd rather have 32 A380's in my order book, than 50 B737's. It's not all about the amount of orders, but the nett value of the orders. Anyone with a comparison between A and B for that? I bet they're not that far behind...

Well you are correct about that, but still we are not talking about ILA but about the Farnborough orders.
BTW: I wouldn't be suprised if the value of Airbus YTD orders is higher than Boeing's as Airbus has more widebody's (and their A32S are often a bit more expensive). Another element, Airbus has only its commercial aircraft( yes ok they have A400M), but Boeing is another story. The biggest part of their money comes from the military part of Boeing. Boeing commercials has probably lower value of orders than Airbus, but for Airbus that's way more important. The total profit Boeing earns is for the biggest part due their military products.
But weren't we talking about the orders at Farnborough. Not about the value of the 32 A380's at ILA.

Look, I don't say, Boeing did it better (for sure now we see the ALC orders isn't booked yet). After the 787 problems of past year the management of Boeing Commercials is seriously renewed. This new management decided not to be in the shadow of Airbus again at the Farnborough Airshow. During a big media event, Airbus' PR departement is running at 500%, while Boeing never did that. The result was that every time Boeing stood in the shadow of Airbus. The new management had enough of it and they decided to fight with airbus at Farnborough. We all know Boeing lost it's first place in the commercial aviation already several years ago and it's not Boeing's most important goal to be first again (altough that's a long term goal), but that doesn't mean they doesn't want to mean something. We now see the result, Airbus did it better and their order value is higher. So what. This a totally different Boeing than we've seen the previous years and I want to make that clear. What do I care Airbus has more orders and a higher order value, they are the world's first commercial aircraft manufacterer so that's normal.

[tolipanebas]

For the first time since a very long time Boeing participated in the orders race at an airshow. This is not the kind of Boeing we are used to see at an airshow, and I want to make that clear.

Okay, and you've done that very well, thank you.

May I now speak for what is the silent majority on this site and say how pleased I am Farnborough is finally over so you can hopefully stop waving that flag and return to your normal behaviour? Obviously you're entitled to sharing your opinion here, but quite frankly it was rather offsetting to constantly see victory reports from you about non-events like the announcement of yet another customer for an order already booked months ago, all of them withheld in the battle over some kind of an artificial 'order race'!

Very sad to see Boeing apparently following suit on Airbus on that field too now by deliberately holding back announcements, as if copy-pasting them on poor progam execution alone isn't enough already and even sadder to see that otherwise respected members here think this change in corporate governance practices is utterly fantastic.
As I've said in another similar topic where I just couldn't stand it any longer: 2 wrongs don't make a right.

You know, normally I wouldn't care, but one of the things that makes this site so attractive, apart from the fact it discusses predominantly Belgian aviation matters in all its details, is the fact it is completely unfamiliar with the all too regular Airbus vs Boeing rants which seem to be constantly interfering with all possible discussions on some other well-known international aviation forums and which quite frankly make any intellectual discussion there impossible, so much even I've given up on posting on them years ago.

There's really no need to introduce that aspect here too,IMHO, especially as you yourself have just asked for a new topic to be created regarding the RJ/737 replacement at SN. This will be a very interesting topic to which many breaking news posts will be added in due time, on condition the thread isn't hjiacked and turned into an Airbus vs Boeing topic like you seem to have some sort of an appetite for, so let's just hope you're going to put that Boeing cap off soon and just discuss fleet matters that are really interesting, without having to constantly defend one manufacturer, since we all know there is zero change of seeing 737NGs at SN...

Thank you.

[RoMax]

May I now speak for what is the silent majority on this site and say how pleased I am Farnborough is finally over so you can hopefully stop waving that flag and return to your normal behaviour? Obviously you're entitled to sharing your opinion here, but quite frankly it was rather offsetting to constantly see victory reports from you about non-events like the announcement of yet another customer for an order already booked months ago, all of them withheld in the battle over some kind of an artificial 'order race'!

The only thing I did was announcing every single order announcement of Farnborough. I mentionned every single Boeing order and ALSO EVERY other order. I really didn't make ANY difference between the Boeing order announcements or announcements of Airbus, Embraer... If you see that as "victory reports" than I think that's your problem and not mine.
BTW: It's not Boeing that's decide to announce an order as unidentified and hold him back until an airshow, that's the customers choice.
Ok, in my last posts I made (very) clear that I'm happy with Boeing at this airshow. SO WHAT? Is there some hidden forum rule wich makes this a crime?

There's really no need to introduce that aspect here too,IMHO, especially as you yourself have just asked for a new topic to be created regarding the RJ/737 replacement at SN. This will be a very interesting topic to which many breaking news posts will be added in due time, on condition the thread isn't hjiacked and turned into an Airbus vs Boeing topic like you seem to have some sort of an appetite for, since we all know there is zero change of seeing 737NGs at SN.

I'm sorry but now you are going too far. Do you really think that I am so stupid to even think SN would acquare 737NG's, do you really think that? Well I give you the awnser: NO. Is there any reason to (like you say it) hjiacke that topic into an Airbus vs Boeing topic? NO there isn't any reason for that!
And as far as I know I didn't hjiacked this topice either into an Airbus vs Boeing topic. I just told the possitive things of Boeing, did I said anything bad/wrong about Airbus: I DON'T THINK SO! That's in big contrast with forums like airliners.net were they do hjiacke the topics.

[tolipanebas]

Look let's not turn this into a war of words, shall we?

This site is great because if is free of all the A vs B controversy, and I really would like to keep it that way, that's all.

Whereas you definitely can not be accused of being anti-Airbus indeed, it is an undeniable fact you also feel the need to put every valid comment or remark concerning Boeing immediately up against a similar case of Airbus, something which is known to spark the well known manufacturer's controversy on that particular site indeed.

Let's stay well clear of that shall we and understand that a negative comment about your preferred manufacturer could be a very valid one and isn't automatically directed only towards them, so there should really be no need to constantly compare one with the other....

Since farnborough is over, maybe this topic should just be closed off so we can start with a clean sheet?

[RoMax]

Since farnborough is over, maybe this topic should just be closed off so we can start with a clean sheet?

Well I think that's a good idea.

To make you (and probably some others) happy, I'll calm down a bit in my reactions on negative/possitive Boeing news.

[sn26567]

Air Lease Corporation (ALC)

STEVEN UDVAR HAZY may not be familiar to regular business travellers but during the Farnborough Air Show his new Air Lease Corporation (ALC) signed up for 136 aircraft including 31 Airbus A320s, 20 Airbus A321s, 54 Boeing 737-800s and 15 Embraer E-190s for delivery beginning in 2012.

ALC will be a powerful player in the years to come in aircraft trading and purchase with the pendulum of airline transactions swinging back towards leasing rather than direct sales and finance deals.

Born in Hungary, he and his family escaped the then Soviet dominated state in 1958 and today is living in the United States and reckoned to be around 300 in the list of the world’s wealthiest persons. He is the former Chairman and CEO of International Lease Finance Corporation (ILFC), one of the two largest aircraft lessors on the planet (the other being the GECAS arm of General Electric). ILFC itself is owned by AIG, still under a shadow following the 2008 financial crisis.

Source: AERBT and www.airleasecorp.com