2010 Charleroi Airport (CRL) latest news

[Philippepompier]

CRL wants to become the 2nd national airport of Belgium : not only low cost but other kind of carrier too with intercontinental flights.
http://www.lalibre.be/actu/belgique/art ... ional.html

It's belga news, so I guess we can find a dutch translation somewhere

How nice what an exitment this is wake up please we are living in a peanut there is no room for a second NATIONAL airport. Just make it the national airport of CRL...

[Propwash]

It's belga news, so I guess we can find a dutch translation somewhere

"Charleroi moet tweede nationale luchthaven worden" (HLN.be)

[Atlantis]

hmm, hmm and the people around the airport and further will now accept the noise of those heavies??

There is no room for a second national airport, besides what's the meaning of national in this country. It will be and allways be against the other.

BRU has a capacity of 30 million pax a year. With 18 miilion a year now there is more then space and room enough to grow.

Instead of stealing pax and carriers away from an other airport they could do the following.
In Walloon they have an agreement: LGG is cargo, CRL is pax. Move away all pax flights from LGG and put them on CRL. Pax on LGG is not working, TCA and Jetairfly are not expanding at this airport and this since 2 years. No significant pax airline is flying on LGG.

They could have two nice airports: a true cargo airport and a leisure and low cost airport.

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

What a bulls**** !
Belgium is as big as a ... and the second national airport on just a stone away !!

Please leave CRL as our NATIONAL LCC airport ! and BRU as our NATIONAL (!) airport !


CX-B

[airazurxtror]

Charleroi is already the second Belgian airport as regards the number of passengers.
But, if I understand well, they want to be some kind of another full service airport, like Brussels.
CRL would have Ryanair like BRU has easyJet - and legacy carriers besides.
London has Heathrow and Gatwick (also one runway), so why not here ?
Both BRU and CRL are or will soon be owned by private companies, Macquarie and SAVE : there is no "stealing" of customers, it's just business and trying to make the most of it and beat the competitor if possible ...
More airports, more flights to more destinations with more airlines, that is always a good thing for the travellers : the more, the merrier !

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

More airports, more flights to more destinations with more airlines, that is always a good thing for the travellers : the more, the merrier !

Maybe, but don't forget that airlines just transfer people from one place to another.
It's not that because there are more airliners in a country that there will be more travelling
people. ( It's only FR who created a more pax. travelling people but we all know why )
More airliners =not= more travelling pax === less PAX/aircraft/destination

Ex.
I travel to Geneva with SN or easyjet from BRU.
Or I go there by EZS or with SN but I don't go there with my brother from CRL because
I like them more for drinking a coffee with!
I surely go drinking a coffee in Pisa with my brother for a coffee because I pay my airlineticket 20 euro
instead of go by train to Bruges which will cost me 30 euro !
But who will win here!
I think the coffeehouse in Pisa, MoL,CRL ( a ticket to Geneva and Pisa ! ) .
Who lost? People in Bruges,the trains,BRU,SN,EZS because I flown from CRL.
For Belgium in total, I just transfered some money from BRU to CRL and put SN-EZS on some risky
units.
Oh yes I forget we paid also (a bit) to MoL for doing business in CRL in the first place.
IMHO,
CX-B

Am I making a point here?

[Conti764]

Wishful thinking I'd say...

Let's not forget the factor Ryanair. Right now, CRL is tailor made for that company. A few gates without a jetway, quick turnaround times and an airport where they actually run the show (compare it to the Brussels - Jet Airways situation three years ago...)

If more full service carriers would come to CRL, it means FR would loose some of its influence at the airport and has to share the pie with those companies, I doubt they are very eager to do so. And CRL without FR is nothing compared to the current CRL, even if they'd manage to attract some full service carriers.

Offering full service flights implies building a new terminal with jetways or at least add them in some way to the current infrastructure. If I look at Google Maps I don't see much room for expansion and the excisting terminal is not ideal for such construction.

Another thing we have to take in consideration... The O&D market in Belgium is not big enough to have a full service carrier to fly to an airport, solely depending on O&D-pax and no airline has any chance of codesharing or transferring at CRL. Our national carrier operates from BRU and from BRU only. They have build a network of partner airlines around them, either Star Alliance or others... This makes BRU the best and actually the only option for any full service carrier to fly to...

So, all in all, I don't see much chances for CRL to grow into the second national airport of Belgium.

Anyway, if there is one thing that I hope CRL will achieve with this idea, it is that BRU will lower its fees.

[Acid-drop]

You know I've always defended CRL over here, but in this case, I have more or less the same opinion than you.
CRL is already the 2nd national airport of Belgium in many people mind.
When you see 5millions pax a year, it's something. It's not a small regional airport anymore.
BUT
CRL is good for what's it was made for : short haul european flights.
CRL is like a high class high speed train station to me, with the restaurants/bar/confort of a good train station.
And indeed, taking a ryanair flight is pretty much the same than taking a TGV from Brussels to Lyon.

Now, for the serious stuff, long haul, it's not quite ready yet.
A much bigger terminal with a better choice of bar and restaurant, with jetways seems the minimum.
I'm not saying it can't happen but work need to be done.
It was planned from the begining that this terminal could get bigger.

Atlantis : I think the charter trafic in LGG and OST will remain for many years. It's a nice plus to offer this cheap close by alternative for belgian tourist. The volume is not bad, and this is not making any competition, so why not keep it just the way it is, without much development.
Regarding the noice in CRL, you know it is a much smaller problem that in BRU, we discussed it many times, I'll not explain again.

On the other hand, we all know that BRU is the best solution for everybody, but it's a matter on how it is managed. BRU is using 1980 rules in a 2010 world. They are loosing the game since many years and nobody seems ready to react. If they continue like that they loose even more. Nobody expected that CRL would grow that fast, i'm sure nobody expect what may happen in the future if BRU continue in the same path.
CRL has a great potential, I find very normal that they try to grow.
And don't forget the low cost long haul is still something to develop.

[cathay belgium]

Hi,

Just a small remark:
Instead of dreaming long-haul, no LCC and so on ..
they better think on ther very very short haul ,
I mean :
MAKING CRL REACHABLE FOR ALL BELGIANS BY PUBLIC TRANSPORT IN A NORMAL WAY AND
WITHIN A NORMAL TIME SHEDULE !!!
( meaning antwerp-limburg region it's a real mess to even get at CRL in the first place. )

CX-B

[Acid-drop]

You are right, they should hurry to get a train station on the airport.
On the other hand, the rapid bus between charleroi train station and the airport is decent, so I guess you could find your way.

[jan_olieslagers]

I agree with Airazurxtor: the term "national airport" belongs to the past. This discussion is void. Airports - ALL airports - want to get as much traffic as they can*. Traffic means business and business means money and money makes the world go around - edgewise.
Does anyone believe Brussels or Charleroi only serve pax/cargo to/from Belgium? What is national about these (or any other) airports?
But of course the title "second national airport" sounds good, even grand, surtout in French... so it will appeal both to politicians and to the media.
It is all about glitter and image creation and getting media attention - Ryanair strategy is setting the example!



*Except of course those in Flanders. Grrrmmmbbblll!!!!

[jan_olieslagers]

You are right, they should hurry to get a train station on the airport.

An airport without a train station is an anachronism today, indeed. But the plans were made for the CRL train station, weren't they?

On the short-medium term, it is Zaventem though that will see improved train service with the Diabolo scheduled to allow direct trains from the Kempen area, and Mechelen and Antwerpen, starting 2012 or 2013.

[Acid-drop]

More about possible long haul from CRL
http://www.lalibre.be/economie/actualit ... leroi.html

- SAVE seems very pro-active
- They understand the rail access is very important
- Discussion are in progress with hainan
- the terminal will grow : + 2 000 to 3 000 m2, +3 gates

[Atlantis]

Be serious please!!

Acid-drop you should know that it is impossible to run an airport with the same fares as today. Fares will rise due to security, handling (catering, water, cleaning), etc etc. I'm curious if the main user of CRL, Ryanair, will be happy with that development.

You can't create "a second national airport" (please what's in a name), with different fares. CRL is 50% government money, Brussels Airport runs its airport with own money. This is not a win win situation, but most people with no aviation experience or inside aviation experience will not accept that.

If you cant to create a second airport in Belgium for interncontinental pax flights you have to change the law. Every single aiport with the same rights (money, noise restrictions, etc etc). Then we can speak.

[Acid-drop]

I'm just the relay of the press I don't necessary agree with all SAVE/Antoine dreams ... but I have to admit I admire their project

If you cant to create a second airport in Belgium for interncontinental pax flights you have to change the law. Every single aiport with the same rights (money, noise restrictions, etc etc). Then we can speak.

The rules are the same already, but the players are different and have different ways to see the future and to invest their money.

[Desert Rat]

You can't create "a second national airport" (please what's in a name), with different fares.

.

Because you said so?

[Desert Rat]

This is not a win win situation, but most people with no aviation experience or inside aviation experience will not accept that.

.

Excuse me?

I don't understant what you mean here.

Who will not accept that?

[Desert Rat]

Who will not accept that?

I won't

So I guess I have to classify you in the "people without aviation experience"...fair enough

[Acid-drop]

SAVE is also interested by BRU
http://www.lalibre.be/economie/actualit ... -save.html

[cnc]

More about possible long haul from CRL
http://www.lalibre.be/economie/actualit ... leroi.html

- SAVE seems very pro-active
- They understand the rail access is very important
- Discussion are in progress with hainan
- the terminal will grow : + 2 000 to 3 000 m2, +3 gates

no offence but what should hainan gain by moving to CRL? the lf would go down dramatically and what with the belly cargo?

lowcost longhaul (if it would ever happen) would be obvious for CRL