Solution for Belgian pilots?

FLY4HOURS.BE · Post by **FLY4HOURS.BE** » 09 Oct 2007, 01:30

If net is 6000€ gross is 10000€ plus social charges of 1500€ is 11500€.

That is about as much as FR's net salary of 11000€

The same is valid for First officers.

And at FR you have 5 more days off per month than at B.air now.

And after all pilots, they don't care about charges, taxes. All they want is the cash and the job-security. After all the social charges you pay you get a miserable pension in Belgium.

And the big question of the day is: why are the Belgian airlines the few of the airlines who don't advertise their salary scales on their websites?

Answer: humiliation

FlightMate · Post by **FlightMate** » 09 Oct 2007, 08:29

You should be mistaken. Taxes are more important in Belgium.
10000€ gross would never give 7200€ net.

And gross salaries for b.air captains with some seniority would more be in the vicinity of 6000€

Furthermore, when Management hired the contract pilots paid around 10.000€ netto a month, they advertised to us that's a bit more but not far from what a belgian captain cost to the company. (but they ain't giving the exact numbers of course)

What's a shame is they ask you to fly in your days off and offer you 40€ for it. And they pay contract pilots at least 500€/working day...

Pretty discouraging.

dre · Post by **dre** » 09 Oct 2007, 10:58

tolipanebas · Post by **tolipanebas** » 09 Oct 2007, 11:27

Two questions, LX

What B.air pilot is earning 7,200 euro net?
I doubt you'll be able to find one, other than maybe some instructor on the A330... Half the net salary you mention and you get a good idea of what an average Captain (with some seniority and working serious overtime) currently takes home at the end of the month, including his per diems!

Secondly, what government should we ask the new tax system from?
At the pace things are going at Hertoginnedal, we'll all be retired before they finally come to an agreement!
Besides, if all it takes for a government to lower the income taxes is to ask for it, I am sure the day after many other sectors of our industry (road transport, textile, car industry etc) too will knock on their door for the same benefits!
In short: it is pandora's box, no Belgian government will ever open it, unless they want to commit budgetairy suicide!

FLY4HOURS.BE · Post by **FLY4HOURS.BE** » 09 Oct 2007, 17:20

Yes LX has misinterpreted the numbers (...leading me into confusion

)

72000€ a year is 6000€ per month....

This is a Gross-net converter:
http://www.tijd.be/geld_beleggen/rekenm ... _bruto.htm

tolipanebas · Post by **tolipanebas** » 10 Oct 2007, 09:02

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote:Yes LX has misinterpreted the numbers.

Ah, that explains it. Sorry then.

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote: 72,000€ a year is 6,000€ per month....

Correct and this a realistic gross salary of a captain at B.air.

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote: This is a Gross-net converter:
http://www.tijd.be/geld_beleggen/rekenm ... _bruto.htm

Well, I've tried it, and it overestimates my net salary with over 300 euro actually. Reason is that the salary converter doesn't know I am a pilot and that as such I can retire sooner than 'normal employees' elsewhere, but since there is no such thing as a free lunch, we also get to pay an additional monthly pension contribution which needs to be deducted from our gross salary too....

LX-LGX · Post by **LX-LGX** » 10 Oct 2007, 09:41

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote:If net is 6000€ gross is 10000€ plus social charges of 1500€ is 11500€.

That's probably the answer you've received from your Microsoft Flight Simulator.

Try it again, but now get your information from an accountant, a HR department or somebody working with real salaries and who knows all different salary scales (example: 6.000 euro nett means highiest scale for additional social charges).

FlightMate · Post by **FlightMate** » 10 Oct 2007, 14:58

jeez LX, it's 6000€ brutto, not netto!

LX-LGX · Post by **LX-LGX** » 10 Oct 2007, 21:18

FlightMate wrote:jeez LX, it's 6000€ brutto, not netto!

Sorry: I've based it on a post from fly4hours.be, and I indeed should have known that also that post was wrong:

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote:
We think that we all know that Belgium has very expensive tax policies, but this is a wrong information:

Ryanair:
Eurozone nett salaries
Captains
Up to €130,000
First Officers (1,500 hrs)
Up to €80,000
B.air:
Captains
Up to €72000
First Officers
Up to €36000

buck · Post by **buck** » 10 Oct 2007, 22:17

Indeed LX-LGX, it is very dangerous to quote FLY4HOURS as he is always
giving wrong and tendentious information.

fcw · Post by **fcw** » 10 Oct 2007, 23:34

LX-LGX wrote:
FlightMate wrote:jeez LX, it's 6000€ brutto, not netto!
Sorry: I've based it on a post from fly4hours.be, and I indeed should have known that also that post was wrong:

FLY4HOURS.BE wrote:
We think that we all know that Belgium has very expensive tax policies, but this is a wrong information:

Ryanair:
Eurozone nett salaries
Captains
Up to €130,000
First Officers (1,500 hrs)
Up to €80,000
B.air:
Captains
Up to €72000
First Officers
Up to €36000

These figures are correct, but GROSS and not nett.
So you see, LX, Gross more than double for an F/O, in nett it is even times three.
So gross salaries are the basic problem, taxes make the differnce only bigger .

FLY4HOURS.BE · Post by **FLY4HOURS.BE** » 11 Oct 2007, 00:38

Euh the Ryanair figures are supposed to be nett salaries...

Ryanair: The salary figures quoted are after tax and including Sector Pay. Flight Duty paid through scheduled Duty Block Hours:- £45 (tax free)
up to 3.5hrs, £80 3.5 - 5hrs, £130 5 - 7hrs, £185 over 7 hrs. Sector pay for all pilots averages £18/20,000 net pa. £22 night stop allowance.
Estimated net monthly earnings are Captains £4,900, FOs £3,650 (average).

This is 2 years ago, salaries have risen since then, and these are average salaries, the salaries quoted before are the top scale salaries (cf=>"up to") nett for both SN and RYR and are thus the right figures.

We don't want to compare the average scale salary, do we