Airbus is potentially developing an A370

Bilboone · Post by **Bilboone** » 08 May 2006, 14:50

Article can be read here

Post by **speedbird1** » 08 May 2006, 16:02

Well seeing as the A350 won't be ready till 2030 by the way it's going at the moment...!
I bet Boeing are quaking in their boots at the thought of the A370... Not!

Emirates

teddybAIR · Post by **teddybAIR** » 08 May 2006, 17:26

I rather think there is confusion with the following news:

http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles/20 ... g+and.html

The article indicates that airbus is going to make significant changes to the A350 design in order to render it more competitive against the triple 7 and the 787. Yet, it doesn't say anything about a whole new project (the coding 370 suggests a new project), but rather mentions the current events as an evolution of the existing project.

Confusion regarding this matter could have led to rumours saying that airbus is to design an a370.

Just my 2 cents though

bAIR

Post by **speedbird1** » 08 May 2006, 17:28

Fair enough teddybAIR

Emirates

ryanCX · Post by **ryanCX** » 08 May 2006, 21:27

If true, such ambivilance will all but ruin Airbus. I wonder if theyb really do have adequate resources for a possible 'A370' after the epic A380 and the impromtuo A350 and A320NG.

Buzz · Post by **Buzz** » 09 May 2006, 01:22

ryanCX wrote:If true, such ambivilance will all but ruin Airbus. I wonder if theyb really do have adequate resources for a possible 'A370' after the epic A380 and the impromtuo A350 and A320NG.

The A380 is payed for, now the cash will start to 'roll in' (hopefully past break even point).
The possible A370 is just a development of the new A350, so it isn't a seperate family. It will be the main source of Airbus' recources in the comming years...

As far as the A320NG goes, that's the big mistery: will they postpone it, or do they really have the cash to take on 2 mayor projects at the same time...
Whe'll see, all in good time.

CX · Post by CX » 09 May 2006, 10:27

No it depends which article you want to believe. Flight Global's seems to think that the A350 will be redesigned and then cross fully, the 787 and 777 niche, and there won't be a A370, or at least an A370 will not just be a 'larger' A350.
The other one is saying that the A350 will be as it is, but a new A370 will be built..

Bilboone · Post by **Bilboone** » 11 May 2006, 12:08

In accordance to this article

It looks like they will drop completely the current A350 whatsoever version and go for a complete new design as also stated in the article at the beginning of this topic but they will keep the original A350 name.
I am curious how the consumers will react , it's confusing enough, I hope for airbus that they are now on the correct track to be a strong concurrent to Boeing's 777 and 787 airplanes.... time will tell

CX · Post by CX » 11 May 2006, 12:41

I hope Airbus, like Boeing, is developing a BWB. No doubt those will take over in the future..

Bilboone · Post by **Bilboone** » 11 May 2006, 13:26

CX wrote:I hope Airbus, like Boeing, is developing a BWB. No doubt those will take over in the future..

Boeing is dreaming / beliefs about this project already a long time ago. somewhere around Airbus started to develop the A3XX that later became A380.
For now it looks more and more it is the right time to build this aircraft. Because a lot of people start to believes in this concept that it has al the good aspects : Cleaner, less expensive to build, stronger, quieter, easier to handle and still within the parameters of the 80 meter box.
But the concept is only efficient enough to carry 600+ PAX.

http://aero.stanford.edu/BWBProject.html project from 1995
http://www.twitt.org/bldwing.htm
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... t/x-48.htm
http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/BWB.html
http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/pdf/FS-19 ... 4-LaRC.pdf
http://www.wingco.com/

abishay · Post by **abishay** » 11 May 2006, 14:17

Bilboone wrote:
CX wrote:I hope Airbus, like Boeing, is developing a BWB. No doubt those will take over in the future..
Boeing is dreaming / beliefs about this project already a long time ago. somewhere around Airbus started to develop the A3XX that later became A380.
For now it looks more and more it is the right time to build this aircraft. Because a lot of people start to believes in this concept that it has al the good aspects : Cleaner, less expensive to build, stronger, quieter, easier to handle and still within the parameters of the 80 meter box.
But the concept is only efficient enough to carry 600+ PAX.

http://aero.stanford.edu/BWBProject.html project from 1995
http://www.twitt.org/bldwing.htm
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... t/x-48.htm
http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/BWB.html
http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/pdf/FS-19 ... 4-LaRC.pdf
http://www.wingco.com/

everything is going fast for airbus

not finished with a380 then a350 and now a370 8O weird
the concept plane is funny and weird looking

can you imagine how hard it would be to get a window seat in that wide thing?? 8O windows seat lovers like me that plane is not a good idea

CX · Post by CX » 11 May 2006, 16:19

a370 is nothing now...

btw i thought airbus is also developing some bwb as well?

Buzz · Post by **Buzz** » 12 May 2006, 01:27

CX wrote:a370 is nothing now...

True indeed, but expect it be be something after Farnborough...

CX wrote:btw i thought airbus is also developing some bwb as well?

Not developing (yet) but it is definitely researching it...

RC20 · Post by **RC20** » 12 May 2006, 01:48

Buzz wrote:
ryanCX wrote:
The A380 is payed for, now the cash will start to 'roll in' (hopefully past break even point).
.

The break even point is actually aircraft delivered, not sold, or pie in the sky maybe (if it doesn't prove up to its claims, the options go out the window and Boeing sells a lot more 747-8s..

Break even was 250 aircraft, (supposedly if you believe Airbus voodoo economics). That was BEFORE the 1 billion Euro overrun due to weight.

they have sold 159 (give them 200 as I strongly suspect FedEx and UPS will pick up their options regardless as that’s a different market driver).

So, lets call it 300 as break even, not even close yet. You still have to keep buy all that material well in advance of production. And they the only reason the airline execs have not tarred and feather Airbus for their shenanigans is wanting to keep the competition up enough to keep prices down somewhat. Same in encouraging Boeing on the 747-8 (and a fallback option for them as well (Boeing is not stupid, they know it, but in that case, any money they can cut away from Airbus is money well spent).

Future sales are going to be a good indicator of how much anyone trust Airbus at this point (very little I believe).

While its too early to say for sure (give it another 8 months) the market seems to be indicating that.

CX · Post by CX » 12 May 2006, 11:34

If those BWB are actually much cheaper to fly, even if there is just a 2 year gap between when Airbus and Boeing will get one flying, the one who gets it going first will win big time!

Buzz · Post by **Buzz** » 12 May 2006, 17:21

RC20 wrote:
Buzz wrote:
ryanCX wrote:
The A380 is payed for, now the cash will start to 'roll in' (hopefully past break even point).
.
The break even point is actually aircraft delivered, not sold, or pie in the sky maybe (if it doesn't prove up to its claims, the options go out the window and Boeing sells a lot more 747-8s...

I wrote "now the cash will start to 'roll in' ", with wich I obviously meant the airlines will be paying for their A380's when they will be delivered. Enough delivered=break even.

RC20 wrote: And they the only reason the airline execs have not tarred and feather Airbus for their shenanigans is wanting to keep the competition up enough to keep prices down somewhat. Same in encouraging Boeing on the 747-8 (and a fallback option for them as well (Boeing is not stupid, they know it, but in that case, any money they can cut away from Airbus is money well spent). .
Oh come on...
Two years ago everybody whas fearing the worst for Boeing.
So Airbus is having a bad year... They're hardly being 'tarred and feathered' as you call it. In case you have forgotten, they're still the biggest aircraft maker IN THE WORLD (we'll see for how long)

RC20 wrote:Future sales are going to be a good indicator of how much anyone trust Airbus at this point (very little I believe). .

They had more than 1100 orders last year. You think they'd lose that trust in 5 months?

RC20 wrote:While its too early to say for sure (give it another 8 months) the market seems to be indicating that.

The market is not indicating anything, except that airplanes are never ordered in the year before EIS (see 777).
And I would say give it another 8 years, not months.

If Airbus (or XYZ for that matter) would be able to get past break even point before the plane was in service, they'd be brilliant. If not, they will just hava to wait a couple of years, and still have a good business going. 15 years of selling A380's will get them there, no doubt about it.

Boeing has done it with their newest plane, wich is a brilliant for business, but it doesn't happen every time. Airbus never expected to get past breakeven (maybe they did hope) before EIS, but they can be relitively sure they'll get past it in the next years...

As Will Smith stated so nicely in 'Independence Day'

"It ain't over 'till the Fat Lady sings"

Buzz · Post by **Buzz** » 12 May 2006, 17:23

CX wrote:If those BWB are actually much cheaper to fly, even if there is just a 2 year gap between when Airbus and Boeing will get one flying, the one who gets it going first will win big time!

BWB is only possible for 600+ pax aircraft.
Since Airbus has the A389 coming up and Boeing doesn't believe in VLA's, you'll have to wait another 15-20 years minimum...

Bilboone · Post by **Bilboone** » 15 May 2006, 18:19

Airbus chief admits to mistakes over new A350 model

In an interview with the German newspaper Welt am Sonntag, made available in advance, Germany's Thomas Enders said Airbus had under-estimated the Boeing 787.