New winglets for A320

Zorba · Post by **Zorba** » 04 Apr 2006, 17:39

Thanks for the links Silver

SilverJET · Post by **SilverJET** » 04 Apr 2006, 18:08

sn690 wrote:Now the Airbusses will look a bit like an Embraer, don't you think??
I really likes the old ones! They looked modern, those are a bit classic I think...

sn690

That's exactly what I was thinking, an oversized ERJ170

but I think I will like them

ehamspotter · Post by **ehamspotter** » 04 Apr 2006, 19:10

Hello;

Not bad, but it is strange to see an A320 with such 'huge' winglets.

rgds:Jeroen

fokker_f27 · Post by **fokker_f27** » 04 Apr 2006, 20:22

Andries wrote:
fokker_f27 wrote:Winglets increase efficiancy. Winglets prevent vortexes coming off the wingtips because they create drag. So winglets reduce the drag.
The do not prevent vortexes, they reduce them ! If they would truly prevent, then you would see every, but I do mean every, aircraft with winglets !

Andries

You're right here. I should have written my phrase different. Sorry.

But Boeing adds 'blended' winglets to the 737NG. Is there any advantage about that, other then looking nice?

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 04 Apr 2006, 20:25

fokker_f27 wrote: But Boeing adds 'blended' winglets to the 737NG. Is there any advantage about that, other then looking nice?

Of course there is !!!!! read this: https://www.aviation24.be/posts13650-start0.html

If I have time I'll explain it later

Chris

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 04 Apr 2006, 20:30

i really feel that winglets are just "a la mode", of course they help to save some fuels, but i think airbus wants their a320s with winglets just because all the new 737 have them...

fokker_f27 · Post by **fokker_f27** » 04 Apr 2006, 20:49

Avro wrote:
fokker_f27 wrote: But Boeing adds 'blended' winglets to the 737NG. Is there any advantage about that, other then looking nice?
Of course there is !!!!! read this: https://www.aviation24.be/posts13650-start0.html

If I have time I'll explain it later

Chris

Yes I know winglets reduce drag and make the plane more fuel efficient, but why 'blended'?

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 04 Apr 2006, 23:32

fokker_f27 wrote:
Yes I know winglets reduce drag and make the plane more fuel efficient, but why 'blended'?

Why some are blended and other not is more a difference in design IMHO. When you need to develop a new component you'll design several solutions for the job you want the component to do. Then you will pick up the most suited for your plane/machine..... Why they took blended ones on the B737 and not on the A320 well, it's not the same manufacturer and thus not the same design philosophy. There is probably not more behind the story. But I might be wrong as well.

As long as both perform like wished on the desired airframes it's ok.

i really feel that winglets are just "a la mode", of course they help to save some fuels, but i think airbus wants their a320s with winglets just because all the new 737 have them...

I partially agree with you. Let's say the winglets are "a la mode" for the following reason:

It was found that winglets will reduce induced drag, and will help you save some fuel. However on some planes like on the B737 or on the B757 those winglets were not installed initially. Now you will see more and more airlines fitting them to their planes for the simple reason that due to the high fuel costs it becomes economically viable to have them.
when the fuel prices were lower the investment costs where too high to get enough back from the fuel savings. Especially on planes such as the B737 where you will only get significant benefits for a minimum flight length.
If I remember well, the costs of installing the winglets on the Virgin Express planes will be recovered in 2-3 years or something like that.

So in fact to sum it up I believe that the trend to put winglets is more economically driven than just a trend to have stylish looking plane. High fuel costs have already marked the aviation industry in the past (symmetrical shaped after body 757, jet engine with rear fan MD80 etc ..) and will do so in the future. Nowadays the footprint of the high oil prices on the design are the winglets.

To end I would like to say something about the looks. Even though the appeal of a nice plane can have some effect on the customer I would rather think that it's small. Airlines will not put winglets on their A320's because the competing airline has winglets on their B737's. Ask people who just had a flight and the majority of them won't be able to tell you if the plane had winglets or not. Don't forget that the majority of pax don't even have a window seat

Just my 2 cents

Chris

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 04 Apr 2006, 23:38

Thank you Chris

earthman · Post by **earthman** » 06 Apr 2006, 15:45

Are there any pictures of the other winglet type? Since this is an Airbus test plane, I assume these are the Airbus-designed winglets. Luchtvaartnieuws.nl writes that the other winglet type being tested is some revolutionary design, as opposed to the standard in-house Airbus winglet design.

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 06 Apr 2006, 16:42

AFAIK the other winglet type wil be tested on a plane provided by JetBlue. The test will probably be done later in the year and therefore no pictures are available.

Chris

CX · Post by CX » 06 Apr 2006, 17:35

the A380 is using the current a320 type winglet though...

edwin · Post by **edwin** » 08 Apr 2006, 19:49

well ya the A380 has it maybe later on they will put the bigger winglets on...who knows

edwin

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 08 Apr 2006, 19:55

they didn't put winglet on the a380, because then the plane would be too wide

edwin · Post by **edwin** » 08 Apr 2006, 20:00

ohh ok

im glad boeing has them already, they've tested them on the 757

CX · Post by CX » 09 Apr 2006, 12:07

well if the A380 winglets are made pretty much vertical like this new A320 one, it won't make it any wider right?

edwin · Post by **edwin** » 09 Apr 2006, 12:34

true maybe if the winglets are succesful on the A320 they would put them on the A380

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 09 Apr 2006, 13:01

As i said aleady, An 380 with winglets would be too wide, and it's already taking a lot of space in airports without winglets...

edwin · Post by **edwin** » 09 Apr 2006, 13:43

yes but how would it be too wide if the winglets are vertical?

fokker_f27 · Post by **fokker_f27** » 09 Apr 2006, 15:01

If one would really want to make an efficient plane, you could add tailets like on the Raytheon Beech 1900. But that's probably too expencive.