Censorship on Luchtzak.be?

SabenaRebirth · Post by **SabenaRebirth** » 06 Apr 2006, 11:57

Some of my messages on the forum were without any warning or reason deleted.

In this topic: https://www.aviation24.be/postt15904.html I made a comment about French speaking people having difficulties with the English language. It was deleted.
Is this forbidden on Luchtzak.be??

In another thread I made a comment "I prefer Boeings". That was deleted too!!

What is going on here??? Can I have some feedback please?

Post by **sn26567** » 06 Apr 2006, 12:03

SabenaRebirth,

You know how language questions can be sensitive oin Belgium. Some of your comments were not very nice to French-speaking people and could have created unwanted reactions. They were thus deleted.

I am not aware of the Boeing topic.

blackhawk · Post by **blackhawk** » 06 Apr 2006, 12:27

It was me who deleted the "I prefer Boeings" because it did not make sence

SabenaRebirth · Post by **SabenaRebirth** » 06 Apr 2006, 13:45

sn26567 wrote:SabenaRebirth,

You know how language questions can be sensitive oin Belgium. Some of your comments were not very nice to French-speaking people and could have created unwanted reactions. They were thus deleted.

8O

This is ridiculous. Ever heard of freedom of speech?
My remarks were not 'offending' towards French speaking people. I just gave my opinion.

But apparently that's not appreciated on this forum.

I don't see why I should stay on a forum were things I say are immediately deleted because some "moderator"(?) thinks -personally- that it "doesn't make sense"...

I'm also in the web-business. I maintain several websites myself and I can say that the 'moderating' on this website scares visitors away. I suggest you read some books from Jacob Nielsen about webteams and web usability! I even had some private messages from other users saying that I'm right about this.

You won't see me again on this forum, I'll go to another aviation-forum where freedom of speech is respected and where different opinions are appreciated.

salut.

blackhawk · Post by **blackhawk** » 06 Apr 2006, 13:54

Does it make sense to put "I prefer Boeing" in the SN-TV merger-topic (I think it was there)? No, because then another members will say: 'I prefer Airbus' and then we have a nice A vs B war going on.

Post by **sn26567** » 06 Apr 2006, 14:18

SabenaRebirth wrote:Ever heard of freedom of speech?
My remarks were not 'offending' towards French speaking people. I just gave my opinion.

Freedom od speech does not give the right to offend other people, and please, let the administrators and moderators judge what is offending and what is not. Otherwise we will end up with problems like the Danish caricatures of prophet Mahomet!

Comet · Post by **Comet** » 06 Apr 2006, 17:12

blackhawk wrote:Does it make sence

The correct word is "sense".

Post by **Bottie** » 06 Apr 2006, 17:57

SabenaRebirth wrote:I even had some private messages from other users saying that I'm right about this...

And I can even guess who they are ...

SabenaRebirth wrote:salut.

... en de kost ...

killerwhale65 · Post by **killerwhale65** » 06 Apr 2006, 19:04

Bottie wrote:And I can even guess who they are ...

No, it was not me

pit600f · Post by **pit600f** » 06 Apr 2006, 19:51

I completely agree about the offense about french speeking ! I saw your post ,it was not nice and for your information, I made a part of my training in Ostend and there are guys from the aeroclub over there who really sucks in English ! And from a flemmish instructor from Ostend , He certified me that some guys speek dutch sometimes! and if you don't believe me , go at Kortrijk!
Man avoid stupid generalities like this ,it remembers me some speachs and ideas about frenchspeaking people of several flemmish politicians!

Rago · Post by **Rago** » 06 Apr 2006, 21:16

jan_olieslagers wrote: Only I had not realized that French-speakers are as delicate as some Muslims. My sincere apologies.

Not only our neighbors from the south! Apparently 95% of this forum is to be classified as "delicate", because neither what you have to tell, there's always somebody who's offended. So the only thing that's left is simply to shut up and read in silence...

Vinnie-Winnie · Post by **Vinnie-Winnie** » 06 Apr 2006, 22:31

In all honesty I really think that moderators on this forum do a good job! It's not easy to make a judgement on some controversial posts. But to remain in the spirit of this forum moderator have to make choices. Whether you agree or not is up to you, but no-one forces you to participate to this forum if you don't agree with the rules.

Just a few notes:

-Bullying in schools is not tolerated, so for the majority of you people why should it be allowed on this forum?
-Opinions like I prefer Boeing are plane silly, because they absolutely don't contribute anything to this debate!
-Posting for the sake of posting something is just a waste of time and space!

Finally if you are not happy, why don't you create a www.flemishaviationfreak.be, or www.iloveboeing/airbus.be???

Vincent (French speaking Belgian, speaks Flemish, likes Flemish people and very tolerant towards others and hierarchy

)

SierraFoxtrotMike · Post by **SierraFoxtrotMike** » 06 Apr 2006, 22:52

Rago wrote:So the only thing that's left is simply to shut up and read in silence...

It is what I do for a very loooooooooooong time.

Kind regards from a Belgian and really proud of being one !

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 06 Apr 2006, 22:56

I don't understand the problems with censoring. There are rules which need to be followed and if we wouldn't apply them the forum would be a total mess.

Of course people can posts some cirtics. Of course we can have interetsing discussions with different points of views. But we shouldn't forget one thing. And that is RESPECT. We should always keep in mind that the other party has also the right to be there and take part in the discussion. And if we don't show repsect towards the others, then I'm afraid but comments need to be censored.

SabenaRebirth wrote: In this topic: https://www.aviation24.be/postt15904.html I made a comment about French speaking people having difficulties with the English language. It was deleted.
Is this forbidden on Luchtzak.be??

No it's not forbidden, but as I said we don't need to forget to be tolerant. I didn't see your comment so I cannot judge. But lately we had quite some comments against french speaking people which were not very friendly. We are a Belgian site and should remain as such. That means that we should encourage dutch speaking as well as french speaking people to take part in the discussions. And by making non respectful comments we won't achieve that goal. Even if some believe the contrary, I truly wish we could all enjoy our hobby regardless the language we speak.

Yes there are some french speaking people who don't make efforts in dutch or english, but you don't need to go far to find dutch speaking people who have the same problem. I don't mind talking about those issues in topics such as the "R/T topic ...", but we should NEVER generalise a certain behavior with an entire group of a population. Keep that in mind and we won't have problems like those anymore.

In another thread I made a comment "I prefer Boeings". That was deleted too!!

What is going on here??? Can I have some feedback please?

As for this comment I'm afraid that it had to be removed. Everyone can have his/her preference I agree. I myself would tend to one manufacturer as well (I won't tell here

). Some facts can even be discussed. But simply making a comment "I prefer Boeing" doesn't make any sense since it will only trigger some Airbus versus Boeing wars on the site. Those debates are endless, childish and ruin the atmosphere. It's not because one moderator thought that it didn't make any sense that your comment has been removed.

I hope you understand now a little bit better.

Chris

EDITS : typo's

jal · Post by **jal** » 07 Apr 2006, 00:11

sn26567 wrote:SabenaRebirth,

You know how language questions can be sensitive oin Belgium. Some of your comments were not very nice to French-speaking people and could have created unwanted reactions. They were thus deleted.

I am not aware of the Boeing topic.

OK, but than it must be apllied both ways

jal · Post by **jal** » 07 Apr 2006, 00:17

sn26567 wrote:
SabenaRebirth wrote:Ever heard of freedom of speech?
My remarks were not 'offending' towards French speaking people. I just gave my opinion.
Freedom od speech does not give the right to offend other people, and please, let the administrators and moderators judge what is offending and what is not. Otherwise we will end up with problems like the Danish caricatures of prophet Mahomet!

This quote = censorship.

According to the definition, as soon as somebody DECIDES their is automaticly censorship .

FREE(or freedom of speech) means nobody decides but yourself.

Aldgate · Post by **Aldgate** » 07 Apr 2006, 07:54

This topic shows that feelings can still run high when it comes to certain topics.

I'm not going to comment on the specific subjects of the topics that were removed. I just have one thing that kind off surprises me...

I'm a member of several discussion boards and all of them are moderated. Moderation is needed sometimes to keep the board from slipping away from its subject and that means that certain posts are edited or removed. But on all those boards, the moderators inform the poster of an edited or deleted post why it happened (in a private message). Is this not done here?

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 07 Apr 2006, 09:52

Dear Jal,

jal wrote: OK, but than it must be apllied both ways

It is applied in both ways. We don't tolerate offending comments against the dutch speaking people either !! We simply don't accept any kind of offending messages.

Freedom od speech does not give the right to offend other people, and please, let the administrators and moderators judge what is offending and what is not. Otherwise we will end up with problems like the Danish caricatures of prophet Mahomet!
This quote = censorship.

According to the definition, as soon as somebody DECIDES their is automaticly censorship .

FREE(or freedom of speech) means nobody decides but yourself.

I don't agree with you. André is right when saying that Freedom of speech doesn't give you the right to offend other people. The limits of everyone's freedom ends where his/her neighbours freedom starts. So yes you have freedom of speech as long as you don't restrict other people's freedom by offending them.
If there won't be any limits, which is simply unthinkable, the forum would just look like a battle field after several months.

Chris

Aviation24.be

Censorship on Luchtzak.be?

Censorship on Luchtzak.be?

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