Vinnie-Winnie,
if you read Fons probable cause here: https://www.aviation24.be/postp106699.html#106699 it might be because of windsheer or adverse weather conditions. But the real reason of the accident is still unknown.
Passenger jet skids off runway, in flames at Toronto airport
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B744skipper
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Aviation Safety also reports about the incident, it seems that there where some 309 people onboard (297 of them passengers, and 12 crew).
http://aviation-safety.net/database/rec ... 20050802-0
http://aviation-safety.net/database/rec ... 20050802-0
Alfonso, Airbus aficionado....
Dear folks, since you all seem to know my first name, I owe you an explanation: 02AUG is the nameday of the saint my parents give me the name of as number 7 in a line.luchtzak wrote:if you read Fons...
What would that matter that to you, you will say. To me it is a day I remember well for many aviation mishaps, the Air Canada Pearson disaster, the FortWorth Eastern one, now the Air France and others. It matters so much to me, I never took a flight on that day. My experience is that day is prone to aviation incidents. That aside, if it were not that many of these mishaps are weather-related:
Here in the AF358/02AUG case some sources mention aquaplaning, some lightning strike, or windsheer.
When you see the videos, it is astonishing how the A340 is on fire. In a downpour as that, see the water on Highway 41. Nevertheless it took fire. After a short lap, the passengers are already off the burning plane, some still in the ravine, others on that highway, the plane explodes, and a little later you'll see the frame braking, cave in, and then you see the tail sagging ( like a bull in a corrida, was the first image that came to my mind - the A340 seemed to have done its job, protecting its passengers, fighting the bad weather, and loosing from the fire) Dramatic pictures, I could not stop repeating. But then I am a Airbus aficionado.
Back to facts, here is an other witness:
As we were landing we thought the pilot was going a little bit too fast, but of course I'm not an expert, I wouldn't know, but we thought he was going a bit too fast
Then we landed and it seemed fine, everybody started clapping until, all of a sudden, we hear this shaking on the aircraft and just took a nosedive on the runway and swerved to the left.
The smoke started after they opened the doors for us to get out. The left side engine blew up very quickly. I guess it hit the ground.
And an other: Everything was perfect. We started our descent. Nobody was worried about anything, just a little bit of turbulence, which is the case for stormy weather. Then the plane, the minute before touching ground, the electricity, the lights, got cut off. The plane was going extremely fast and the power shut down completely, but we thought that was because of the rain ... Then we could feel were off road, and then it was really, really scary.
The Airbus A340 that crashed Tuesday has a good safety record -- it is the first plane to crash since the aircraft was introduced by manufacturer Airbus more than a decade ago. So investigators are more likely to be looking into weather conditions and practices at the airport that day. (Cliff MacKay of the Air Transport Association of Canada)
Weather reports around the time of the accident were volatile. The wind had spun around at the time the airplane landed, that wind had been spinning around all afternoon.... almost 180 degrees the other way -- it was very active weather all afternoon. (Mark Miller, aviation expert for The Discovery Channel)
Other experts tend to go for the human factor: The pilot's impulse to land, even during inclement weather, is considered a factor. A pilot loses objectivity and …. They're tired, they're in another time zone, they don't want to end up flying to another airport and all the inconveniences for the passengers.
And: When we come to land in the airport, everybody is clapping to the captain.... but after that we felt bump, bump, bump ... then through the window I saw fire.
Please read also: Windshear associated with squall lines is also a potential hazard to aircraft during landing and take-off.
If you look at the "least spectacular photo", the one with the small (...) fire at the back of the plane, you will also notice quite some fire brigade vehicles on that photo. How long did it take for those trucks to get there? I guess at least 1 to 2 minutes. So the big fire only started several minutes after the glide, giving the crew enough time to evacuate.
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Advisor
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I hear all 309 have survived the crash. Thank god.
And why were people clapping is because they were cheering and applauding as the plane was landing, relieved to be on the ground after flying in circles above the airport because of the rough weather. If you notice the flight had already had several scary moments, including an apparent power failure that plunged the cabin into a dead, dark calm.
fftopic:
I remember on a trip of mine from Bombay to Rome on Alitalia when we touched down, people were clapping then too, because on a jumbo when we touched down, we did not even realise as the landing was so smooth.
And why were people clapping is because they were cheering and applauding as the plane was landing, relieved to be on the ground after flying in circles above the airport because of the rough weather. If you notice the flight had already had several scary moments, including an apparent power failure that plunged the cabin into a dead, dark calm.
fftopic: I remember on a trip of mine from Bombay to Rome on Alitalia when we touched down, people were clapping then too, because on a jumbo when we touched down, we did not even realise as the landing was so smooth.
Aum Sweet Aum.
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Watch The server is busy message may come but please be patient and watch. Courtesy BBC.
Air France's Official Press Release:
Air France flight AF 358, inbound to Toronto from Paris, had an accident while landing at Toronto Pearson Airport. The aircraft, an Airbus A340, carried 297 passengers and 12 crew members. Everyone on board the jet was able to get off the plane. There are no victims. 22 passengers suffering minor injuries are treated at area hospitals.
Air France is doing everything to give assistance to passengers who where on board flight AF 358.
Air France has established a passenger information centre, and a toll-free number is available for family and friends of those who may have been on board flight AF 358 The toll-free number is :
For those calling from France : 0 800 800 812
For those calling from outside : + 33 1 56 93 10 00
For information about our flights, please refer to the "Schedule - Flight status" section of the site.
Aum Sweet Aum.
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Allnipponairways
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Horrible but thank god everybody ok
oh my god , but thanks god 8O all 309 on board are ok andfine, just a few hurt 8O , the crew reacted perfectly then ... getting all off board so quick ..and calming down the pax so WELL DONE TO THE AIR FRANCE CREW AND THEIR TRAINERS ... EEN PLUIM EROP ...hopefully i never have to do what they have done , but experience gives valuable lessons ... off course in the report on yahoo , they will blame it on the pilot that he pulled the rudder to hard ..always pilot mistake, lets see .. the weather was very bad and i guess the controller should ave said , no way of landing here now AF
.. Go to another airport ... they are also to blame then the tower if the weather was to BAD ... 
but anyways once again
GOOD CREW AND GOOD COMMUNICATION MAKES PERFECT IN GOOD AND BAD CONDITIONS<
greets
The plane was the F-GLZQ . HOw weird!!!
i had a picture of this plane as a Wallpaper for a while,
this was the 340 which was going to Philipsburg / St. Maarten.....
i had a picture of this plane as a Wallpaper for a while,
this was the 340 which was going to Philipsburg / St. Maarten.....
Last edited by Ovostar on 03 Aug 2005, 13:51, edited 1 time in total.
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Airbus330lover
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Easy to complain.Some passengers are saying that the crew didn't reacted so well, and that they were not agreeing with the Air France statement concerning the crew.
The result of the incident is well no fatalities and 16 with minor injuries.
It's not everyday that a company can give such a result after a real incident.
Don't forget, the crew opened the doors and evacuated all the passengers.
I am not sure that other crews (companies with strict minimum training and "lighter" crews) has become the same result.
What was a miracle, could have been a momentous disaster, with an enormous loss of life. Its serves to remind us how frail these aluminum tubes we call aircraft really are, yet all survived and with only minor injuries.
It also serves to remind us how important evacuation tests are and why the time requirement is so stringent, one minute longer getting all those people off that aircraft would have resulted in a very different outcome.
I think we all will pay a little closer attention to the flight attendants when the safety demonstration is given.
To all the flight crews of Air France, A job well done! you should be proud.
It also serves to remind us how important evacuation tests are and why the time requirement is so stringent, one minute longer getting all those people off that aircraft would have resulted in a very different outcome.
I think we all will pay a little closer attention to the flight attendants when the safety demonstration is given.
To all the flight crews of Air France, A job well done! you should be proud.
Last edited by bits44 on 03 Aug 2005, 18:55, edited 1 time in total.
297 pax onboard. That's quite high for the A340-300. The Air France website says the capacity of its A340 is about 245. Strange!
About 2/3 of all accidents are blamed on pilots, and the rest on weather. This one may be a combination of both.
That God no one died. That's good. It's very curious why the traffic control allowed the plane to attempt to land at the time of severe thunderstorm.
About 2/3 of all accidents are blamed on pilots, and the rest on weather. This one may be a combination of both.
That God no one died. That's good. It's very curious why the traffic control allowed the plane to attempt to land at the time of severe thunderstorm.
Those passengers were probably very shocked and angry, sometimes you say things you don't really mean.
The fact that there is no loss of lives shows that the crew did a great job, congratulations. There was a wounded copilot checking whether there was no-one onboard when he left the plane as the last person on board, that's a good job!!!
The fact that there is no loss of lives shows that the crew did a great job, congratulations. There was a wounded copilot checking whether there was no-one onboard when he left the plane as the last person on board, that's a good job!!!