ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015

[sean1982]

Yes, and very soon indeed; already this autumn!
Nice lobbying from the Belgian government, BRU and SN combined.
Shows you that when they work together, they can achieve much more than just low cost riff raff.
More information on frequencies, schedule and SN code shares to come...

Looks like the soep kouder wordt opgegeten dan opgediend, if even managing the code share didnt work. Nice lobbying indeed

[RoMax]

It has nothing to do with Japan Sean. Neither with SN or ANA, and not even Belgium (at least not directly).
But who knows there already is a solution underway and interlining is no problem anyway.

[Inquirer]

Hmm, interesting piece of information ROMAX.

My best bet: they need to be included in the Joint Venture of Lufthansa group airlines with ANA to be granted full legal immunity by the EU to work closely together as if they were one airline (similar to how they do it on the transatlantic) and such takes time: the fact ANA launched 6 months sooner than everybody expected them to may be the main reason it may or may not be ready from the start, but I highly doubt hey would have dediced to axe their CDG flight for this route to BRU if it were not to take full benefit of the potential extra feed BRU can deliver them.

Any news on whether they plan to regularly deploy the bigger 787-9 on this route, or if this will just be a one of promotional visit?

[RoMax]

The JV is another matter and a big step further than a codeshare. Also SN could codeshare on flights beyond Tokyo and ANA on flights beyond BRU and they can interline on the non-stop flight between the two hubs.
It's a very stupid regulatory thing actually. But again, last time I heard about this was some time ago shortly after the announcement of the route, I don't know if the same problem is still valid. However it is interesting that there is no word yet on a codeshare agreement so..

[lumumba]

But there is already a code share at least on the flight's beyon Brussels.
On the site of ANA you can book flight's from multiple European city's true BRU.

[RoMax]

As I said, there is no problem on flights beyond BRU. The only problem is the flight between BRU and Tokyo itself.

[lumumba]

Ha ok thx
So that means that SN can not code share beyon Narita!
But that's not a big deal in any case they are star members,so for a M&M member the airline does not matter.

[sn26567]

But that's not a big deal...

For the passenger maybe not, but for SN, which gets a commission on every passenger eventually booked on an NH flight, it makes quite a difference!

I wonder why this codeshare problem hasn't been solved yet. It should have been solved at the time of the announcement of the new flights. Or is it at the European Commission level that things are not running smoothly?

[lumumba]

I understand that but they also fill there planes with the transit passengers to Narita.
So they make money anyway.

[RoMax]

No it is on the NRT-BRU-NRT route itself (so ANA can put its code on SN flights and SN could even puts code on ANA flights beyond NRT, but not on the NRT flight itself). It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.
Also mind that with a codeshare, passengers are counted as passengers of the airline on which code it is flying and not the operating carrier. So SN codeshare passengers on an ANA flight are in fact SN's passengers for which ANA gets paid, that's different from SN selling ANA tickets through a different sort of agreement when these are in fact ANA passengers.

[sn26567]

It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.

Why should SN be able to put its code on Hainan flights to PEK and not on ANA flights to NRT? The routes are similar!

[RoMax]

Why should SN be able to put its code on Hainan flights to PEK and not on ANA flights to NRT? The routes are similar!

I don't know the details, but restrictions can be route specific, can limit number of flights/routes/seats, etc. Bilateral agreements often don't apply logic anyway, they apply politics.

[Stij]

No it is on the NRT-BRU-NRT route itself (so ANA can put its code on SN flights and SN could even puts code on ANA flights beyond NRT, but not on the NRT flight itself). It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.
Also mind that with a codeshare, passengers are counted as passengers of the airline on which code it is flying and not the operating carrier. So SN codeshare passengers on an ANA flight are in fact SN's passengers for which ANA gets paid, that's different from SN selling ANA tickets through a different sort of agreement when these are in fact ANA passengers.

Of course... Russia...

Stij

[Flanker2]

Well you can't peg it on Russia alone. They didn't start this whole mess of Ukrainain instability leading up to mutual sanctions.
Too bad that such things end up affecting seemingly unrelated airlines like SN, but I'm sure that they'll find a solution. SU has almost left the BRU-NRT low yield market as TK is too agressive on pricing and their weak Rubble doesn't allow them to compete anymore.

[RoMax]

It's not just Ukraine and the sanctions that make Russia a difficult country. It took years before they allowed SN to operate into St Petersburg without having to compromise on other things (Moscow) and this started way before the problems with Ukraine.
Regarding Aeroflot, that's probably the best example of a fully governmental funded airline that relies on them for everything (and in exchange has to keep the Russian aircraft industry alive through orders for their own or one of their many daughter companies).

[Flanker2]

SU wanted those additional daily frequencies for their day flights long before SN considered Petersburg I think. For a long time SU couldn't connect efficiently to their Asia flights from BRU. It's like an endless falling in love story I guess... But Brussels being the capital of 'hostile' EU doesn't help the situation I guess.

In my experience they can be either very accomodating or very stubborn. But I think that NH can negotiate this better as the Japanese government is very friendly with Russia at the moment.

[Flanker2]

NH upgraded my early November flight to B789 already (which has a larger Y section).

It sounds like they are positively surprised by the demand. Looking at the seatmap, it suggests that my flight's Y section would have been nearly full if operated by B788.

[brusselsairlinesfan]

Still no news on the SN codeshare for the BRU - NRT flights?

[BRUpilot]

I'm sorry if my question has already been answered here, but I haven't found it...
Is ANA planning daily 787-9 services or daily 787-8 services? Because of the visit of the special star wars-plane, i got al little confused.

[Inquirer]

NH upgraded my early November flight to B789 already (which has a larger Y section).

It sounds like they are positively surprised by the demand. Looking at the seatmap, it suggests that my flight's Y section would have been nearly full if operated by B788.

That's very positive news, for sure.
If this route grows further organically over time, I wonder what the next step might be one day? 777?