Ryanair in 2015

[sean1982]

To make another Investigation to come to the same conclusion that Ryanair follows all current european Union regulations with regards to aircrew operating on european registered aircraft.

[Passenger]

To make another Investigation to come to the same conclusion that Ryanair follows all current european Union regulations with regards to aircrew operating on european registered aircraft.

Not that long ago, a French judge ruled (in appeal) that Ryanair didn't respect French labour legislation:
https://www.aviation24.be/forums/viewtopic ... 80#p308183

The intermediate verdict BATA now has is a step forward to a final verdict in Belgium.

[sean1982]

On a decree that doesn't exist in Belgium ... For employees that are allready paying belgian social security contributions?

[airazurxtror]

Ryanair’s Business Plus fast-track security service is being extended to Gatwick from February 2.
The Irish budget carrier is also introducing the scheme at Rome Ciampino from March 2 and Eindhoven from April 1, with more airports to come as it seeks to attract more business travellers.
More than a quarter (27%) of Ryanair passengers travel on business and the carrier is seeking to capture more. Chief marketing officer Kenny Jacobs : “Ryanair will carry over 24 million business customers this year".

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/Articles/ ... twick.html

[Stij]

Ryanair’s Business Plus fast-track security service is being extended to Gatwick from February 2.
The Irish budget carrier is also introducing the scheme at Rome Ciampino from March 2 and Eindhoven from April 1, with more airports to come as it seeks to attract more business travellers.

One question remains: when at BRU?

Cheers,

Stij

[Inquirer]

To make another Investigation to come to the same conclusion that Ryanair follows all current european Union regulations with regards to aircrew operating on european registered aircraft.

Yet from what I understand from it, it's not about the airline being Irish and thus being subject to Irish law: the court tries to establish whether or not Ryanair -as an Irish registered company- has an operating base in Belgium or not and thus needs to apply Belgian law too.

I don't know if you have heard of this, but as of last summer, the ECJ has handed down several land mark decisions in which several multinationals doing business in the EU from an Irish HQ (Google most notoriously) were found to be in breach of several aspects of national legislation other than Irish, thus brushing aside their main defence argument: i.e. that they are 'foreign', from the moment it can be demonstrated the multinational has a physical and permanent establishment constituting an important operational element to their business in any memberstate concerned.

It's a fairly new approach by the ECJ to the territorial application of national law by EU multinationals doing business in the whole of the EU which is indeed quite new and groundbreaking of course, and it has far reaching legal repercussions for pretty much all multinationals which so far were hiding in one EU country only (also mine, btw, I admit), so if indeed BATA succeeds at demonstrating there's something like a "Ryanair Belgium" in practice, it's routine operations here should in fact be falling under Belgian law (too) and all of its staff here in Belgium could then benefit from the higher levels of protection too of course, regardless where the HQ is situated, something which is definitely good news for all those working there.

If a company doesn't want that because of the higher costs, it then has no other choice but to make sure it is conducting its business in a certain EU memberstate which it wants to avoid being subjected to, either from outside that memberstate, or through a clearly non-permanent and limited establishment in that memberstate only.

I don't exactly know how to translate that to an airline I admit, but I should think it would mean that there woudn't be any planes nor crew based here, and everything has to be either flown in in the morning, or they need to put crews in hotels then? How does ryanair operate in France, without having any bases there?

[sean1982]

Your (biased) understanding is wrong. The rules for airlines are different due to the international character of this type of operations. JAF also uses belgian rules in it's planes based in france ann morroco. And once again, we allready have belgian social security protection AS WE ALLREADY PAY CONTRIBUTIONS HERE!

[Passenger]

Your (biased) understanding is wrong. The rules for airlines are different due to the international character of this type of operations. JAF also uses belgian rules in it's planes based in france ann morroco. And once again, we allready have belgian social security protection AS WE ALLREADY PAY CONTRIBUTIONS HERE!

Sure you did- just like you did in France. However, the French judges (tribunal ànd appeal court) decided otherwise. Shame on them.

(Jetair is not on trial here. And if Jetair would indeed do in France and Morocco what you say they do, your lawyers have an easy case)

[sean1982]

My partner flew for JAF as a pilot .. Easy case it is

[Inquirer]

A few kind remarks, sean:

first of all, because somebody doesn't fully share your point of view, doesn't make him biased; has it ever come across your mind it may be YOU who's actually a little bit biased here, being employed by ryanair?

secondly, having to apply Belgian law is more than just paying social contributions of course; one needn't be employed in aviation to know that there's much more to it.

thirdly, I noticed the court doesn't share your view, yet you can't say they are biased, can you?
Rather than simply dismiss it on technical/procedural grounds, it ordered ryanair to provide it with all the relevant data: that doesn't mean it will rule unfavourably of course after reviewing it, but it does hint at a verdict based on the factual evidence provided to it, and not on purely technical/procedural grounds like the ones you've so far been using.
This could indeed be a significant legal precedent, similar to the case in France above... or it could not. We"ll have to see what the court rules in its wisdom, but it does seem like the court isn't simply going to throw the case out just like that.

[sean1982]

Stick .... Horse .... Dead

(Btw, Ryanair probably employs more Belgians than SN, JAF and Thomas cook together. Some food for thought)

[sn26567]

Btw, Ryanair probably employs more Belgians than SN, JAF and Thomas cook together.

Do you have figures and a source? That would very much surprise me: see the report of the National Bank of Belgium for 2013 (even knowing that Ryanair only started at BRU in 2014). Furthermore, on the 6 Ryanair flights that I have made this year, there was hardly a Belgian crew member on board.

[sean1982]

RyanAir is a bit bigger than just BRU and CRL

[theeuropean]

New route:

CRL - CPH from 25 October.

Source: http://www.check-in.dk/ryanair-aabner-r ... -stockholm

[Stij]

CPH form CRL??? Now I don't get the Irish anymore!!! That would have been a typical BRU route...

I think CRL's management is sleeping a lot better at night than a year ago...

My two cents...

Cheers,

Stijn

[RoMax]

Was my first reaction as well, CPH-BRU would have been a route that fits 100% in FR's claim of operating more business-like routes from primary airports. Probably they see that flying to/from BRU is not in all cases a perfect solution and CRL still offers better conditions for their operations.

Even if new things are still to be announced for BRU, I still have a feeling they are not expanding as planned or expected a year ago.

[sean1982]

Scandi-routes are traditionally not an instant succes for FR. Probably testing the waters here

[theeuropean]

I am also surprised.

Scandi-routes are traditionally not an instant succes for FR. Probably testing the waters here

I'm not so sure...without having started they increased frequency on the London route which will now be 3x daily instead of 2 and Bergamo 2x daily instead of 1x daily. All other routes are daily.

In relation to BRU - CPH there are plenty of opportunities with SN, SK. With SK I can also get youth tickets which is also a bonus for me (since I am still a student and under 26 years of age).

I think the MAD - CPH route still has an overcapacity (Air Europa, Norwegian, Iberia Express all serve the rout) and there will be one of the carriers reducing frequency or pulling out all together (even after SAS pulled out).

The Stockholm route - understand they fly it, it's a very busy intra-Scandinavian route. I do wonder why they did not try and get a more business friendly route into Arlanda, because I do not see many Stockholmers venture out to Skavsta for that flight - but I do wish to be proven wrong.

Best of luck to Ryanair and Cph!

[airazurxtror]

http://www.lalibre.be/economie/actualit ... 01a16eeba9

Ryanair va ouvrir une nouvelle ligne reliant l'aéroport de Charleroi (BSCA) à Copenhague, la capitale danoise, a-t-elle annoncé vendredi au Danemark. La liaison quotidienne sera lancée le 25 octobre prochain.
A l'automne dernier, la compagnie low cost avait indiqué qu'elle allait faire de l'aéroport de Copenhague sa seconde base danoise à partir de mars 2015. Ryanair va y stationner quatre avions grâce auxquels elle compte assurer, dans un premier temps, 28 vols hebdomadaires. Les premières liaisons débuteront le 26 mars, à destination de Londres Luton, Varsovie et Milan. En octobre, de nouvelles routes seront ouvertes, notamment vers Charleroi, Madrid, Rome et Stockholm.

Ryanair will base 4 aircraft at Copenhagen,
First flights from 26 march to London Luton, Warsaw (Modlin), Milan (Bergamo).
Daily Charleroi-Copenhagen from 25 october.
Also in October : Copenhagen to Madrid, Rome, Stockholm.

[Stij]

Scandi-routes are traditionally not an instant succes for FR. Probably testing the waters here

Testing??? With a base of 4 aircraft???

Cheers,

Stij