Terrible KLM

[nldogbert]

hi!

Well, I just got off the phone with KLM. Gosh, they are just unbelievable..
Anyway, the story is like this, over here in Belgium, they are having currently a 10 days internet sale to most of the continents around the world. And this morning, I was about to book one of the fares over the internet. And guess what just as it was in the process of transisting my Credit card details, the server went into maintenance mode..
I of course had to start the whole process again.. and guess what the fare went up!
And when I looked at the breakdown of the fare.. I noticed that the fare without the taxes was still the same, but the increase was due to the taxes.. a 50 Euro increase in taxes! I was like shocked! Tried it a few times and got the same taxe quote..in the end I decided to call the e-service department to enquire about this.. as usual, they tried doing the same booking and got the same tax figure..nevermind. I thought ok, I will be happy if you could tell me why the sudden increase in the taxes. I was told it was due to the new fuel surcharge by KLM, as quoted by the agent, " KLM has now a fuel surcharge of 3% based on the base fare". I then pointed it out that even with that increase, that would not lead to 50 Euro. To cut things short, she could not justify this increase and asked me to call the KLM office at the airport to enquire about it. I called, and got connecte only to Aviapartner... so I decided to call the KLM Brussels office (which is actually the reservation in NL).. they too could not understand why this sudden increase in taxes. Was directed to call the e-service desk again. This time I got another agent.. had to explain the whole situation. This time this agent told me that he did not know about the 3%, but even if it was true, he said base fare are fares based on the IATA fares. True, but 3% of that would not lead to 50 Euro's. After a long "argument" he decided to get an answer from the supervisor.. and guess what was his answer after that, "KLM does not need to justify these increase". I explained to him, can't u even give me a breakdown as to which goes to the airport taxes, the security surcharges and whatever charges. No, it is not possible. It is just like that. No explaination, you either take it or leave it.
The agent suggested that I should write an email to the Customer Service Department to enquire about.. hell no, am I going to waste my time writing.
Thus, in the end, where does that extra 50 Euro come from... none of us in the public would know.
Now, I have decided not to book that fare. Heck with KLM.. I mean am I wrong in this situation? I just wanted to have an idea to what I exactly will I be paying my 50 Euro for. I don't mind paying for it if you could tell me roughly where it goes to.. I am not asking for more, just a justification of why this increase? Ok, maybe bad luck for me to have choosen such a time to make the booking..

Well, if anyone has any idea.. I would be more then glad to hear it out. In a way I do feel cheated on the whole matter.. if it was a fare increase, ok, comprendo, but taxes.. and what more such an increase..

p.s: sorry if this mail is a bit too long.. still rather upset about the whole thing.

Thanks for reading..

[sab319]

KLM sucks, trust me I had only bad experiences with them

[Sabena_690]

@sab319: if I remember what your "bad" experiences were with KLM (read that in your Cyprus trip report), than I hope that other travellers have some more common sense.

@nldogbert: the reaction of the KLM employees was just ridiculous. To which destination did you want to fly? Air France is running a simillar 10-days-crazy-sales-campaign (although they are not covering several destinations mentioned in the promo of KLM). Maybe you can have a look at www.airfrance.be?

Frederic

[nldogbert]

Hi!

Frederic: Was planning to fly to Atlanta with their impressive price. Yesterday and this morning (before they decided to do some housekeeping with their server), a price of 285€ incld tax. And after their "housecleaning", the price shot up to 337€ with tax. As mentioned in my mail, if this increase was in the fare, I would accept it, but an increase in the taxes.. without explanations.. unacceptable.
I could not even get the price as advertised (ie 322€).. since I guess the price would increase only due ot the increase in fare and not taxes. So i really feel that this is like cheating the clients.. I don't think there is anyway anyone would get the price of €322 as advertised (isn't this against the advertising law)?

Too bad can't find the same destination on AirFrance.

However, thanks for the replies so far..

[Sabena_690]

Hi nldogbert,

For info: €337 is the correct price!

My guess is that, for some reason, KLM quoted you a wrong airport tax first, before changing to the real airport tax.

Saw the price on BRU-ATL a few days ago, and I was amazed! The reason for the cheap flight is because this is a new destination for KLM.

Frederic

[Avro]

I really feel sorry for you nldogbert

[nldogbert]

Hi

Thanks Avro..

Sabena: Anyway, well, I think that no matter what, this should not be the way it goes.. even though if you have inserted the wrong tax or not.. I am eligible for an explanation.. and anyhow, I guess in a way, if I have decided to get the product due to your mistake I should have been granted the product..

yep, knew that it is the return of KLM to Atlanta.. as a Skyteam member..

Anyway, I guess it is just bad luck for me.. but still rather irritated about the whole thing. In a way (not to offend anyone, but just typical Dutch attitude! Especially the agent behind the phone and the answers they give)

[Flybe]

I don't think there is anyway anyone would get the price of €322 as advertised (isn't this against the advertising law)?

I think you could for sure try, although i don't know if you really have a legal base. I can just tel you the following (similar) story:

About 1 year ago, my father was searching for a new company car (lease) and we found in the newspaper an advertisement for a BMW 5 series for a very low lease price. My father went to several BMW garagists but none of them wanted to lease a car to him for that price. After that he contacted the lease department and also they did not want to help at first. But he kept the article and faxed it to them. They gave him a hard time about all administration things he had to do, but at the end, they had to give him that car for that price that was mentionned.

What happened? Well, later we saw the same advertisements with the same price, but 1 small difference... In the advertisement my father had seen (and kept) they advertised that price VAT included, while the new advertisement had the price with VAT excluded... I don't need to tell you that it makes a huge difference. So legally, i think you could force them, but as i'm not a laywer, i can't tell you your chances in court or so... But keep on fighting, it might pay of! It did with us 8)

At the end it is them who messed up, and they are accountable for their mistakes. Only you need some solid proof that you can't reach that advertised price anymore.

Greets,

Pieter

[SN30952]

Too bad can't find the same destination on AirFrance.

The reason for the cheap flight is because this is a new destination for KLM.

Air France-KLM is expected to show a profit at the operating and net levels in the first quarter.
Excluding the "badwill*" realized by Air France on its takeover of KLM, net profit is expected to total 90 million euros for the quarter.

Air France-KLM is scheduled to publish its results at 0500 GMT on Thursday and hold a conference call with analysts at 1300 GMT.

Read tomorrow in Luchtzak.

*Badwill occurs when a company buys another for less than the value of the target's shareholder equity. As opposed to goodwill, it has a positive effect on the accounts of the acquiring firm.

[Sabena_690]

Sabena: Anyway, well, I think that no matter what, this should not be the way it goes.. even though if you have inserted the wrong tax or not.. I am eligible for an explanation.. and anyhow, I guess in a way, if I have decided to get the product due to your mistake I should have been granted the product..

I agree with the first part of your sentence but not with the second part.

Of course you deserve an explanation. But... do not forget that the people you contacted didn't know what exactly happened. If a computer problem occurs, and the computer suddenly quotes you a cheaper fare than the official fare, nobody will be aware of the situation.

The fact that you could not proceed with your booking probably had something to do also with the fact that a computer glitch had occured.

If you had been able to make the reservation, KLM would have granted you the fare (most probably). But since you could not make the booking, you of course do not have the right to ask KLM to grant you the cheaper fare.

@Fons: after having seen your input again during the past few days, you cannot believe how glad I am you returned! You are able to learn a lot of enthusiasts a lot of information! Keep on posting!

Frederic

[MD-11er]

I agree with the first part of your sentence but not with the second part.

Of course you deserve an explanation. But... do not forget that the people you contacted didn't know what exactly happened. If a computer problem occurs, and the computer suddenly quotes you a cheaper fare than the official fare, nobody will be aware of the situation.

The fact that you could not proceed with your booking probably had something to do also with the fact that a computer glitch had occured.

If you had been able to make the reservation, KLM would have granted you the fare (most probably). But since you could not make the booking, you of course do not have the right to ask KLM to grant you the cheaper fare.



Frederic

Fred you are completely right on this one.



KLM is a very good company, I understand that you can feel offensed by the way the answered your questions, but it will happen more in the future and not only in the airline industry.
I don't try to say they reacted correctly, but their are much worse things in the world than an IT problem for once.
The price they offer is still very attractive. Even for that price it's worthwile flying to ATL. It's a nice city, I've been there a copple of times. You can visit the CNN studios and the Coca Cola company.
And not so far away from ATL is a great lake where I used to do some jetski.

So even for a some more expansive price try to go and enjoy ATL.

8)

[Flybe]

But since you could not make the booking, you of course do not have the right to ask KLM to grant you the cheaper fare.

Maybe not the fare of 285€ indeed, but if he can't get the fare of 322€ (Meaning if nobody can get that fare, because if that fare is for example only for students or so, that is a different case, then they are correct), he MIGHT have a case. Because they have to sell what they advertise, i guess... And they have to have enough "in stock" to sell enough of those promotions (there was once the case of Aldi on that problem of not having big enough stock for promotions, if i'm not mistaking). Of course the difference is very small, so i don't know if it is worth the trouble...

Anyway, as i haven't seen those advertisements, i'm not really in a position to comment on this, i fully admit.

Greets,

Pieter

[Sabena_690]

Hey md-11er, I also fully agree with you!

The fare for BRU-AMS-ATL without taxes is currently €194, which is incredibly cheap.
The fare inclusive taxes is €322, which is a bargain considering the fact that a flight to ATL is normally difficult to find below €400.

If you really want to go to ATL, I would not hesitate to book it!

Frederic

[nldogbert]

Hi!

Guess what, KLM did it again.. I guess they realised that they were "deciving" the consumers with their 322 Euro offer the last few days and they decided now to adjust the taxes to suite the offer.. so now the taxes has been reduced from the quoted to me number of Euro 147 to now Euro 127..so, now at least u can get the action fare stated.. guess they are lucky to do ..

But sadly, still not the cheaper fare that I saw..

[LJ]

And they have to have enough "in stock" to sell enough of those promotions

The problem is that the pax ex BRU aren't the only wanting a piece of the stock. Moreover if one flies BRU-AMS-ATL-AMS-BRU one not only has to do with the invetory on AMS-ATL-AMS but also on BRU-AMS-BRU, which considering it's a small plane, will be empty quickly (especially in the low fare classes). This problem is almost unique for aviation as in most other markets the inventory for a particular service doesn''t usually depend on two or more independent inventories (the inventory for BRU-AMS-BRU is seperate from AMS-ATL-AMS as I can book the same fare class ex AMS thus lowering the stock BRU-AMS-ATL-AMS-BRU without flying ex BRU).