Air Belgium: a rebirth?

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RoMax
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by RoMax »

Acid-drop wrote: 18 Apr 2017, 17:36 So its forbidden to try and fail in this country.... wonderful.
I don't understand the "in this country" because most countries have a policy whereby the civil aviation authorities have to agree on the feasibility of the business plan and therefore often ask quite detailed questions.
That has nothing to do with "try and failure is forbidden" but with the fact that you don't play with the safety of people and in a second degree a failing airline can cost a lot of people and companies a huge amount of money in a matter of weeks, which they will never see back, it's an extremely risky business with a huge amount of stakeholders involved. What has the business plan to do with safety? Simple, it's not a secret that many airlines try to save money at the cost of safety, especially smaller ones and start-ups. Just having an accountable financial director is not enough, civil aviation authorities will demand a thorough understanding of how much funding you need for the type of business you want to operate, where that money will come from, which customers you target (and indeed the answer 'Chinese touroperators' can very well trigger the reply 'please confirm which ones' because that's a very vague and dubious answer) etc.

And still MANY airlines fail relatively soon after receiving or renewing their AOC, so it's definitely not THAT strict that it prevents you from failing if you really insist on that right ;)

DeltaWiskey
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by DeltaWiskey »

Passenger wrote: 18 Apr 2017, 17:28 To obtain an Belgian AOC, an airline has to proof that it is has enough financial background to survive 6 months without revenue.
To be honest, they definitely need that kind of money to have any chance of being successful. It takes a lot of financial resources to start a long haul operation, remember that most long haul destinations are not profitable in the first (or even two) years, and that is for an established network carrier.

pitrixplanespotting
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by pitrixplanespotting »

OH-LQD (next OO-ABA?) did something that looks like a test flight on the 28 April
http://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircr ... qd#d368b3a

nordikcam
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by nordikcam »

pitrixplanespotting wrote: 01 May 2017, 21:13 OH-LQD (next OO-ABA?) did something that looks like a test flight on the 28 April
http://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircr ... qd#d368b3a
I assume the crew did this test flight with the new uniform ! :lol: AOC ? Aircrafts ? Destinations ? Airport base ?

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sn26567
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by sn26567 »

pitrixplanespotting wrote: 01 May 2017, 21:13 OH-LQD (next OO-ABA?) did something that looks like a test flight on the 28 April
I guess it is still all white?
And what about OH-LQE (which had the oneworld livery)? Still in Malta?
André
ex Sabena #26567

SLM
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by SLM »

Very strange...Air Belgium is so quiet!

Passenger
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by Passenger »

It seems that OH-LQC (one of the four A340's, according to Airfleets.net) flew from Helsinki to Spain on 10th May.

Not certain to where it flew - Flightradar hasn't registered its landing:
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/airc ... c/#d573294

DIBO
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by DIBO »

it flew straight to here

nordikcam
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by nordikcam »

DIBO wrote: 14 May 2017, 23:30 it flew straight to here
...with the uniforms ? :roll:

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Yuqu12
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by Yuqu12 »

Is that airport Teruel?

TLspotting
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by TLspotting »

Passenger wrote: 14 May 2017, 21:44 It seems that OH-LQC (one of the four A340's, according to Airfleets.net) flew from Helsinki to Spain on 10th May.

Not certain to where it flew - Flightradar hasn't registered its landing:
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/airc ... c/#d573294
I don't know if it's a good thing or not but I don't think so...
Hi. I'm Thibault Lapers. @ThibaultLapers & @TLspotting

brusselsairlinesfan
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by brusselsairlinesfan »

Is the Air Belgium project dead ?

Passenger
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by Passenger »

brusselsairlinesfan wrote: 16 May 2017, 12:52 Is the Air Belgium project dead ?
No. They still don't have their AOC, contrary to their expectations (I guess). See similar issue in the topic VLM Airlines 2017: "..."SHS Antwerp Aviation, the Belgian parent company of VLM Airlines d.d., has applied for an AOC with the Belgian Ministry of Mobility in September 2016, but the certificate has unfortunately not been granted yet..."

convair
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by convair »

Contrary to what some people seem to think, I don't think an AOC certificate should be granted automatically to anybody who asks for one.
Starting an airline is not opening a newspapers kiosk!

Passenger
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by Passenger »

convair wrote: 16 May 2017, 13:25 Contrary to what some people seem to think, I don't think an AOC certificate should be granted automatically to anybody who asks for one. Starting an airline is not opening a newspapers kiosk!
In case you should refer to me with your "contrary to what some people think...": I indeed think that it is not normal that the Belgian CAA needs more then 9 months to take a decision. For an new AOC, the CAA has to check all requirements from an existing checklist. Most difficult question is probably financial sustainability, but it is not normal that it takes more then then 9 months to audit a business plan. Specially not when it has been confirmed/audited already by an international firm like KPMG or E&Y.

convair
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by convair »

Passenger wrote: 16 May 2017, 13:52
convair wrote: 16 May 2017, 13:25 Contrary to what some people seem to think, I don't think an AOC certificate should be granted automatically to anybody who asks for one. Starting an airline is not opening a newspapers kiosk!
In case you should refer to me with your "contrary to what some people think...": I indeed think that it is not normal that the Belgian CAA needs more then 9 months to take a decision. For an new AOC, the CAA has to check all requirements from an existing checklist. Most difficult question is probably financial sustainability, but it is not normal that it takes more then then 9 months to audit a business plan. Specially not when it has been confirmed/audited already by an international firm like KPMG or E&Y.
I was not referring to you in particular.
An AOC certificate should remain something difficult to obtain, imho. However, I agree that there should be a time limit for accepting or refusing (with a motive) to grant such certificate. And maybe there should be an appeals level (not a political one though!) in case of refusal.

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sn26567
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by sn26567 »

If VLM could ask (and obtain) an AOC in Slovenia, maybe Air Belgium should ask an AOC in China...
André
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airsrilanka
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by airsrilanka »

Any chance Air Belgium flying direct flights to Colombo in Sri Lanka?

I remember those days, Belgium charters used to visit Sri Lanka every winter season.

lucas
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by lucas »

I don't think they will do it it the first few months/years. The will focus first on China.

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airsrilanka
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Re: Air Belgium: a rebirth?

Post by airsrilanka »

lucas wrote: 17 May 2017, 13:11 I don't think they will do it it the first few months/years. The will focus first on China.
It will be better if Air Belgium focus on the destinations not served by Brussels Airlines.
They better not compete each other.

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