27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

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Passenger
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Passenger »

jan_olieslagers wrote:There is a lot of sensationalism there, how could there ever have been a catastrophe pending? If dispatchers have less reliable/precise tools, separation is increased. If dispatch/traffic control becomes impossible, the airspace is closed. Drastic, yes, and of course nobody would willingly do so. But safety has not at any single moment been endangered, for as far as I can observe.

Without wishing to enter into politics, I can only confirm the media are _not_ to be trusted. Not in matters of aviation, and why sould they be different on other subjects? They are either incompetent or willingly lying, I often suspect both at the same time.
Not at all. The media are not allways to be blamed. Example: reports from Elke Pattyn (VTM) and Luk De Wilde are always accurate, just like when Staf De Lie (Het Nieuwsblad) reports about Antwerp (ANR). The problem with the Flemish media is that internet has caused that the sales of (paper) newspapers has decreased, with revenue from online adverts not compensating the loss. This has caused dismissals on editor's level, with Belga nowadays about the sole news supplier. Most articles there are written by "general news journalists", and they have to produce x articles each hour. They are not "willingly lying" as you state: they just don't have the time to write better articles.

Today's breaking news about the near-disaster from May 2015 is totally different. It's produced by a journo from the left-oriented newspaper De Morgen, assisting a few ATC's who wanted to blame Belgocontrol. Aim: to weaken the government's statement that there is no budget for investments and/or salary increases at Belgocontrol.

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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

Thanks, it is good to learn that at least some able journalists are left.
And I think we agree that there was not the least beginning of a disaster, nowhere near.

sean1982
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by sean1982 »

Elke Pattyn and luk de wilde are always right? Pattyn flashes a JAF airplane whenever she can, even if it has nothing to do with the story for obvious reasons and Luke de wilde, a self proclaimed "aviation specialist" (what study makes you that anyway?) doesnt even understand that crew sometimes do a turn and come back straight away. (When the SN pilots allegedly fell asleep above france, he claimed that he didnt understand how they could be tired on a "short" flight from ACE to BRU :roll: )

DIBO
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by DIBO »

jan_olieslagers wrote:... how could there ever have been a catastrophe pending? If dispatchers have less reliable/precise tools, separation is increased.
If everything suddenly stops working , ATC can't do anything, not even increase separation. With a full radar failure, you could go procedural. With electronics failing, you could continue with paper strips. But no comms (air & landline), you stop to exist as ATC centre.
jan_olieslagers wrote:If dispatch/traffic control becomes impossible, the airspace is closed. Drastic, yes, and of course nobody would willingly do so. But safety has not at any single moment been endangered, for as far as I can observe.
The airspace was closed for incoming/departing traffic, but everything in lower ATS region, was still flying up to their clearance limit, and then blood pressure started to rise all over the place. I won't state that safety has been endangered, but safety margins certainly reached the absolute minima's. Regional towers handled part of the traffic (initially via 121.5), but they are not staffed, nor organised to coordinate and handle traffic, normally handled by an Area Control Centre. I remember one plane over BRU at FL90 (iirc) being cleared by EBAW TWR to KOKSY to leave the FIR and even if this was done with the best coordination possible given the circumstances, the double & triple safety nets normally present during normal ATC (or aviation in general) operations , weren't there. I "witnessed" just a small part of this event, and found it (as a bystander) pretty scary.

And of course, newspapers are not the best place to get the complete and objective facts....

Nevihta
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Nevihta »

jan_olieslagers wrote:And I think we agree that there was not the least beginning of a disaster, nowhere near.
You agree... please go and talk to an ATC what it feels like to be blind and deaf-mute when your job is to communicate.
DIBO is totally correct...

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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

I must admit I had imagined the situation where all the IT and screens go dead*, without realising that comm's radio's had also failed. That does change the picture, yes it does.

But frankly, on any trip beyond the village spire, I carry a handheld transceiver with a set of fresh batteries (while I am not legally obliged to carry any radio!). Are you guys telling me there isn't such a device available at Steenokkerzeel? Buried perhaps in a forgotten cupboard, probably next to the Aldis lamp, but surely there has to be SOME kind of plan B? To be deaf-mute must indeed be a horrible feeling for an ATCO.


*indeed I once managed to provoke such a situation in a more or less comparable traffic control centre

Mercator
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Mercator »

The telephones failed as well. And do you think a handheld device would have enough power to reach an aircraft 60 NM away ?
There is a lot of redundant equipment at Steenokkerzeel, even backup radios, they just all failed. :roll:

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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

do you think a handheld device would have enough power to reach an aircraft 60 NM away ?
Yes, given "line of sight" which is normally the case. A 10W transmitter is not hard to realise in a handheld device and my Trig TY91 has no more than that.
they just all failed
Well, shit happens, of course. Still I can't help wondering why no stand-alone battery powered radio(s) were/are available. Come to think of it, they needn't even be hand-held. Given the very essential character of R/T for ATCO staff, I should think this evident. But yes, I know, it is easy to suggest improvements after things went wrong. Still I hope the lesson has been learned and some such equipment will be installed now - shouldn't cost an arm and a leg, after all.

EBBU
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by EBBU »

I don't want to elaborate on the events of that day but I will say this :

Everything that happened was 'impossible'.

When CANAC 2 was put online, it was made clear to ATCO's and technicians alike that the redundancies in the system were more than adequate to avoid a catastrophic failure.

But when the screen that has to display the info from the regular source and the backup source is the same screen and it is u/s for whatever reason, even 10 backups won't save the day.

On a human and personal level, I can assure you that the impact of this 'impossible' event was severe, not only for the ATCO's but also the technicians and even the managers. And this includes the ones that were at work during the event and the ones that weren't...

sean1982
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by sean1982 »

And you only came to that conclusion while having Union talks more than a year after the event? Black Swan events can always happen and no matter how good your preparations and staffing levels/money sources are, they will be problematic and potentially traumatic. That's why ATCO's are paid so much in the first place no?

jan_olieslagers
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

Dear EBBR tower staff, thank you very much for explaining things as they happened, and for bearing with me. I think I have a better view now of the situation as it was, and scary it must have been.

Passenger
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Passenger »

Interim Investigation Report (25/08/2016) (162kB):

http://mobilit.belgium.be/sites/default ... 015_05.pdf

(don't expect many new facts...)

Passenger
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Passenger »

And here it is: the final report "Power outage at CANAC 2 Air Traffic Control Center on 27th May 2015":

http://mobilit.belgium.be/sites/default ... report.pdf
(pdf 2,02 MB)

(available in English only)

jan_olieslagers
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

Ah! Thanks for update!

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

Thanks Passenger,

Lots has been said about the ATCOs in the recent past and not always positive, but the report also mentions this :

Quote :
...... Some of the elements here-above are due to chance (meteorological conditions), but most are the result of the company’s safety culture and the quality of the ATCOs training and qualification.
End quote.

Worth reading.

H.A.

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sn26567
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by sn26567 »

A neutral wire not connected to the earth? That's one of the first things you learn in an elementary electricity course!

And absence of a contingency plan? No comment. That's utterly ridiculous and stupid.
André
ex Sabena #26567

jan_olieslagers
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Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by jan_olieslagers »

A neutral wire not connected to the earth? That's one of the first things you learn in an elementary electricity course!
Sorry André, that is an oversimplification, to say the least. Indeed, as far as household installations go, in Belgium there is usually no connection between zero and protective ground, though in the Netherlands there usually is. That is the difference between a TN-network and an IT-network. The report carefully explains the difference, too.

You can try it for yourself: simply plug a voltmeter between protective earth and both power connections of any power outlet. One of these is neutral so it should read zero volts if you are correct - well, it may, but it doesn't always or everywhere. Should you take the test repeatedly, you might well find a correllation with atmospheric conditions - as also mentioned in the report.

Regarding the lack of a contingency plan: I have already stated long ago that the non-availability of a couple of simple handhelds is unacceptable and inexcusable. It seems obvious some people believed too much in the total reliability of the system - now of what ship does that remind me?

[[edit to correct a misinterpretation by myself: there does exist a configuration called an IT-network. Apologies, Mr LB! ]]

Hue

Re: 27/05/2015 Major power failure at Belgocontrol

Post by Hue »

Media report on the remarkable reaction of atco's after the power failure (only available in dutch) : http://m.deredactie.be/#!/snippet/58404 ... 7110cf88d2

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