Replacement of Brussels Airlines' Boeing & Avro RJ fleet

[Air Key West]

As we have already seen, some AvroRJs are being replaced by wet-leased turboprops (Q400s with a seating capacity of about 70 pax).
Like tolipanebas told us in another thread, on fligths to Strasbourg the average number of pax is about 25. On the few occasions when I flew b.air to SXB, indeed there were not more than 30 pax. The same goes for a number of other destinations. My question : is the EMB135 to expensive to operate these thin routes ?
Is the Q400 not too large ? Would the new ATR42-600 not be the best option for b.air to operate thin routes if or when they decide to no longer depend on wet-leases ?
http://www.atraircraft.com/newsroom/pre ... 81-en.html

[OO-ITR]

according to skyliner SSN has joined the fleet on the 21st
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.main?LC=nav4

[OO-JFP]

according to skyliner SSN has joined the fleet on the 21st

I think it says that the registration has been applied (the N259AD sticker removed) prior to delivery.
The delivery is imminent I assume but didn't take place yet.
OO-JFP

[CTBke]

plane has been introduced as from today

[CTBke]

and another 734 is about to leave Brussels Airlines ... normally it'll be the OO-VEK

[RoMax]

and another 734 is about to leave Brussels Airlines ... normally it'll be the OO-VEK

Oh, OO-VEK, the last 734 I've flown with (at least until July, when I'll fly another 734, but not from SN)

[CTBke]

my last flight on it was a AGP and since then it's parked at general aviation .. today arrived with SNC next to it

[DannyVDB]

In the last issue of the B-there in flight magazine it is stated as well:

12 A319
4 A320
1 737-300
2 737-400
and
4 RJ85

So I assume that those 4, together with the B737s will be phased out before the end of the year.

2 additional DH8-Q400 will be added
Any other A319 or A320 will join before year end or is that foreseen for next year? Maybe 3 to replace the Boeings or will they reduce the numbers further?

Regards,
Danny

[DannyVDB]

And in the July-August issue of B-spirit it says:
B737-400: 1

Danny

[CTBke]

and the November issue of B there will say 0 737-300 and 0 737-400 boeings are about to be phased out after summer season . ..

[sn26567]

2 additional DH8-Q400 will be added

Now that the government will reduce the labour costs for Belgian airlines by 30 million euro per year, can we hope that those Q400s will be leased directly from a leasing company, and not wet-leased from another airline? (I don't think that SN is ready to buy aircraft under its current financial situation).

[airazurxtror]

and another 734 is about to leave Brussels Airlines ... normally it'll be the OO-VEK

A good memory of my only flight with OO-VEK : a BRU-ATH (to the Club Med of Marathon) in the splendid red livery of Virgin Express ...

[tolipanebas]

I assume that those 4 [RJ85], together with the B737s will be phased out before the end of the year.

Almost: 1 will stay as spare aircraft this winter in case one of the Q400 breaks down or can't operate due to extremely bad weather.

Any other A319 or A320 will join before year end or is that foreseen for next year?

Another 2 more A320 are called for in the fleetplan, with 4 more A319/A320 for next summer.

Can we hope that those Q400s will be leased directly from a leasing company, and not wet-leased from another airline?

That would complicate the fleet once again -after finally getting rid of the 737- and mean they'd have to build yet again another costly maintenance inventory.
SN will focus on an RJ100/Airbus fleet for the foreseeable future, just like LX; what will replace the RJ100 will be decided later.

[airazurxtror]

Now that the government will reduce the labour costs for Belgian airlines by 30 million euro per year, can we hope that those Q400s will be leased directly from a leasing company, and not wet-leased from another airline?

Yes, those 30 millions per year are meant to ensure "good conditions of competition" with Ryanair, but might give Brussels Airlines an unfair advantage towards other airlines (like Flybe in this instance).

[RoMax]

The costs about operating an own Q400 fleet is going way beyond some lowered labour costs... Maintenance to say one thing, training of staff to say another thing,...

And again, this 30 million is for the whole Belgian aviation per year. We are talking about lowered labour costs (that my cost up to 30 million to the Belgian state). So the same counts for Jetairfly, Thomas Cook and TNT Airways. SN will not save 30 million, SN will save a part of that 30 million. Same labour costs for JAF pilots, same for TNT pilots, ... They will save as much per pilot (or other (flying) staff?) as SN will do, and all these savings of all these people will account for 30 million, not just SN.

Btw, Belgium will bring the labour costs on the level of or neighbour countries, that's still higher than these in Ireland, so I don't think RYR (or their defenders) should comply...

[CTBke]

and another 734 is about to leave Brussels Airlines ... normally it'll be the OO-VEK

Oh, OO-VEK, the last 734 I've flown with (at least until July, when I'll fly another 734, but not from SN)

and once it was all green while flying for Citybird )

[airazurxtror]

And again, this 30 million is for the whole Belgian aviation per year. We are talking about lowered labour costs (that my cost up to 30 million to the Belgian state). So the same counts for Jetairfly, Thomas Cook and TNT Airways. SN will not save 30 million, SN will save a part of that 30 million.

30 million per year for 10 years is 300 million.

According to the new EU rule, Ryanair will have to pay the full Belgian charges for every Belgian-based crew newly hired during the next ten years.
What about the personnel newly hired by the Belgian airlines during those ten years ?

[shockcooling]

And again, this 30 million is for the whole Belgian aviation per year. We are talking about lowered labour costs (that my cost up to 30 million to the Belgian state). So the same counts for Jetairfly, Thomas Cook and TNT Airways. SN will not save 30 million, SN will save a part of that 30 million.

30 million per year for 10 years is 300 million.

According to the new EU rule, Ryanair will have to pay the full Belgian charges for every Belgian-based crew newly hired during the next ten years.
What about the personnel newly hired by the Belgian airlines during those ten years ?

Please don't soil this topic with another SN/Ryanair bashing...

[RoMax]

According to the new EU rule, Ryanair will have to pay the full Belgian charges for every Belgian-based crew newly hired during the next ten years.
What about the personnel newly hired by the Belgian airlines during those ten years ?

The Belgian labour costs for crew will decrease for everyone, I suppose RYR will pay exactly the same as SN or JAF or anyone else will do, isn't that logicall?! Isn't that fair?!

And again, this 30 million is for the whole Belgian aviation per year. We are talking about lowered labour costs (that my cost up to 30 million to the Belgian state). So the same counts for Jetairfly, Thomas Cook and TNT Airways. SN will not save 30 million, SN will save a part of that 30 million.

30 million per year for 10 years is 300 million.

What's the difference, SN will not save 30 million each year, or 300 million in 10 years... RYR will have extra costs because even the lowered Belgian labour costs are above these in Ireland, but it will not make a huge difference for them until we are 10 years later (when all their crew must be registrated in Belgium).

For me this discussion is closed, If you think it's not, discuss in another topic or in PM. This is not the place for it.

[Inquirer]

According to the new EU rule, Ryanair will have to pay the full Belgian charges for every Belgian-based crew newly hired during the next ten years.

Yet then surely this decision from the Belgian government must be good news for them too, because it will also be applicable to them too???